Bulbapedia talk:Project Walkthroughs

About

This Project started late 2005, and the only completed one is the Colosseum one? Is there no interest? File:207MS.gif Gligar 23:15, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Ranch

Are we going to have a walkthrough for Ranch? I'm playing through it at the moment so could write one if you want? --FLAMER! 21:54, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Is there any storyline in Pokemon Ranch?? I dont think so. All that happens is if you deposit 999 pokemon you get to trade a pokemon egg for a mew from hailey.--Usyflad (10) 22:58, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

Other Walkthrough Sites

Could we get some info from other sites? I mean whenever you're freely paying a Pokémon game, you don't really think of how to do specifically like a walkthrough. I mean, not copy and paste, but copy and paste THEN we make it in our own words... I think I know a couple walkthrough sites.--DRAGONBEAST^X 18:15, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

Why not kill walkthroughs altogether? Nobody comes to 'pedia to get a walkthrough. They go to IGN or CheatCC, or GameFaqs. It's a big waste of time.--RexRacer -talk 18:21, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

You're actually right, with saying that. I mean, why should we even have this project, if nothing's happening here and there's quite a couple of sites that have walkthroughs?--DRAGONBEAST^X 19:31, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree. This project is obsolete and time-consuming. Like RexRacer said before, nobody goes to Bulbapedia for walkthroughs, they go to other sites. --Usyflad 10 23:02, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

The Pokédex Pokémon pages are also on other sites and the routes as well. Anyway, don't we want more people to come to Bulbapedia? Pyles 01:24, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

I agree. Isn't a major goal of Bulbapedia's in general to be as complete as possible anyway? If there were a functioning walkthrough section, it would certainly attract more people. Not everybody uses them, and that's fine, but if people want to contribute in a productive way, then shouldn't they? If nobody else is really motivated about it, I'd be happy to help out. --^KCorp4000 16:11, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

I'm new here and I stumbled upon the Project so I thought I would contribute. I'm doing a Crystal Walkthrough since I have some spare time and no one has started a crystal walkthrough yet.--User:Kolink

um...

shouldnt the pmd2 walkthrough follow the chapters of the game EX: Chapter 1: Lost at Sea --Usyflad10 23:31, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

i put them to chapters but theres still the pages that title: Section 1, Section 2, section 3. could some on delete them cause i dont know how. --Usyflad10 21:40, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

here are the links Appendix:Mystery Dungeon 2 walkthrough/Section 1, Appendix:Mystery Dungeon 2 walkthrough/Section 2, Appendix:Mystery Dungeon 2 walkthrough/Section 3 --Usyflad10 21:43, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

You or Player

in the walkthroughs do i write "you" or "the player"? --Usyflad10 03:08, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

It's hard to say. I've used both interchangeably in the Red & Blue walkthrough, though you could also combine them, linking one to the other (like →you←). I don't think a walkthrough is really an encylopedic entry, so I don't think it would really matter. ^KCorp4000 16:55, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

I agree with KCorp4000. Most walkthroughs use 'you' and it makes more sense that way. Kolink

This is a walkthrough not an article/content, so yes, You is permitted--ForceFire 05:30, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Okay. Thanks for clearing that up. --^KCorp4000 05:45, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Might I suggest that it would be better, to keep with the written style of the wiki as a whole, to infer 'you' rather than directly state it? For example: Instead of: "After you defeat Norman, he will give you the Balance Badge" Use: "After defeating Norman, the Balance Badge will be awarded" This way avoids using the second-person, but also avoids removing the reader entirely, as "The player recieves the Balance badge" would do. It's a standard way of writing that can be seen in any professional instructions/step-by-step guide. Personally I think that would better fit with Bulba's standards, and maybe get this project taken more seriously. --Raylax 19:51, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Sapphire

I am new here and was told I could contribute to this. Is there a Sapphire Walkthrough?

I forgot to include my name. I am GaryMaister31.- unsigned comment from GaryMaister31 (talk • contribs)

Here, my friend. Oh... and sign every time you make a comment on a talk page.--Clarky13 22:30, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

There is a to do list link on the main project page. That list tells what walkthroughs are unfinished, in the works, or complete. Kolink

Project Leader?

Who is the project leader of this? I would like to talk to them about the state of this project - whilst I'm aware that a lot of good work has gone into it (I really wouldn't be writing this if I had no interest in the project), I can't help but feel that the non-standard written style employed makes the articles feel out-of-place on this wiki. I'm also aware that a fair few Bulbapedians think that this sort of stuff should be left to GameFAQs and the like, but I disagree. However, I do believe that the project needs seriously overhauling and brought up to the same standard as the rest of the Wiki. See my suggestion further up on this talk page under "You or Player?" for the sort of stuff I'm talking about. Please don't think I'm just some random newbie with barely a userpage to his name and an over-active trolling gland. I really do believe that this is a brilliant project, but one currently with several faults with style and organisation, which I would like very much to help fix if the project members are willing to consider it --Raylax 20:07, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

That's a good question. I agree with you, I'm happy that more people are getting involved, but I think we should have some agreed-upon format. I've worked on the walkthroughs for Red/Blue & Gold/Silver, and have generally kept the same format throughout. But there are enough styles at work here that some people may find them too cluttered and hard to read. Sher-e-Bengal is the leader of our parent project (Project Games) if that helps. As far as I know, we don't have a designated leader here... --^KCorp4000 18:25, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

I personally think that the walkthroughs here should have an instructional written style, although I'm not sure how well that would go down since (it would seem, at least) it would mean rewriting every article. And making them considerably less interesting to read and write. I can see the appeal of the more personal colloquial written style, but it seems to grate somewhat with Bulba's style and they feel out-of-place. If there is no real project leader for this, can I suggest that the members elect one? I suspect that may be a key problem with the lack of organisation here. --Raylax 20:50, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Despite the lacking of a Project Leader at the moment, admins would be happy to discuss the problem and set ground rules... --^Psychic_Rider^☮ 20:52, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Elections wouldn't be a bad idea. With or without a leader, the project certainly needs some continuity between articles. --^KCorp4000 10:57, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

Has anyone given any more thought to an election? If we could establish a hierarchy, then we could consider standardizing the articles. Without an agreed-upon method, the collective pages are chaos. --^KCorp4000 15:23, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Ranger

There should be a walkthrough for Pokémon ranger--Combee123 (tAlk) 23:45, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

There is one, though it hasn't been edited substantially since January. There just wasn't a link on the to-do page. --^KCorp4000 16:27, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

Logo

The current logo should be changed into something that is actually related to the project. Here are two of my suggestions. File:Possible future project walkthroughs logo.pngFile:Possible futue project walkthroughs logo 2.png --Combee123 (tAlk) 07:56, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

I quite like the second one.Alsabeehaazoooz 23:33, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

Actually, never mind. I've got a better idea on what we could do with those two pictures--Combee123 (tAlk) 19:55, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

The logo isn't changing. End of story ^Maverick_Nate 20:33, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Just wondering

why is the username at the top bold? Is it because the user is the project leader? Turtwig A (talk | contribs) 16:14, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

I think Combee123 used to be the leaderAlsabeehaazoooz 04:23, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

He wasn't, he just made an account this October.--♫Green♫ギャラドス♫Talk♫ 04:38, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

There is no leader for this project. User142 created this project.--ForceFire 04:41, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

I'm fairly sure it was just a mistake he made, because Maverick Nate changed it soon after.--♫Green♫ギャラドス♫Talk♫ 04:42, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

I know this is old, but why is the navigation, search, and toolbox below the page now?. Turtwig A (talk | contribs) 12:37, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

It's the same way for me, too. Combee123 changed the layout again, the new code just shoved that all down. --^KC 4000 17:19, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

But why does Combee123 want it that way? I think it looks better when it isn't shoved down. Also, doesn't Combee123 need permission before changing the layout like that? Turtwig A (talk | contribs) 19:39, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

I don't know. The tabs at the top aren't really a bad idea, but it is a little annoying to scroll to the bottom for that stuff. Ideally, all members would need permission from the Project Leader to change anything on the project page. Since we don't have one right now, it's basically a free-for-all. No single member currently has any more authority here than the next, so if one person can change something, there's no reason someone else can't. I'm working on editing the page, anyway, since some info needed updating - it should be looking a little more workable before too long. --^KC 4000 20:14, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Current State of this Project

Well, I couldn't help notice what a mess this project is and how there is no project leader to guide things through. Are people still currently working on this or is it now just obsolete? I think some kind of definite decision should be made so people are who are still contributing aren't wasting their efforts. Since this project seems so huge and given the different amount of games being covered, maybe people should split up into teams for each game to keep it up to standards? On the subject of standards, if there is a project leader, maybe some new standards should be placed to keep things more organized.--Jello 22:47, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

I don't think there is a project leader, but this project is not obsolete. Tyler53841 does the most, and if we are to recruit a leader, it shold be him. The standards should be made, however, as some of the pages are lacking, and could have better grammar and better follow the Bulbapedia:Manual of Style. How the crap is this going to be split into teams??? Of course there's a lot of games, but you don't see Project Games fussing about it. It's not really logical to be split into teams, and there isn't anything wrong with a lot of contributors, as everyone who does a little counts. That's the way Bulbapedia works. --Smartkidhen 23:06, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

I agree, this project is neglected and somewhat of a mess. The Diamond and Pearl walkthrough is not even like a third of the way done and we're seeing HGSS released in the U.S. this March. I was improving some of the HGSS walkthroughs and in some of them, there wasn't even a structure; the headers were just formatted as normal text. I don't think enough people know about this project to actually improve or write new sections. People mostly focus on the games (encyclopedic), anime, TCG, manga, and the likes. I am also not liking the non-encyclopedic language used in these articles: e.g. in a HGSS article, it referred to Prof. Elm as a geezer. I wouldn't consider that formal language, would you? --DialgaRULES_{(contrib es)} 23:14, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Definitely not, clearly that type of language is inappropriate for a walkthrough, also I have been working with new ideas to further improve the structure. See what you think of these:

a. No personal strategies are permitted since it is unnecessary wording and is occasionally someone's opinion. The exception is small tips or details of any potential danger involved. My last four Gym coverings on the Ruby and Sapphire walkthroughs is a good example of small tips, since my walkthroughs involve gameplay to produce the best accurate details.

b. Should the listing on the normal appendix pages for the game page be like Ruby and Sapphire and list all the routes and locations where despite the extra space, it makes it easier to track, or just be like Diamond and Pearl and only list from start to finish to save space.

c. Things of lesser value should be cut down or not mentioned to avoid too much details. Such as that I only list noteworthy items in the summaries, or use the Later... header to deal with revisits to routes or locations that have little value, namely for things like Item pickup or item trades.

d. Then there are minor things like how many sections each part should have or the the preferred size and other minor flaws that need to be found and addressed.

These are what I have for now to help the quality of these pages. I also know there are more surprises coming along the way. -Tyler53841 06:48, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Tyler, I've been looking at your walkthrough for reference as well as the D/P one for the HG/SS walkthrough. I haven't followed it exactly, as I'm using a more aesthetic template for the trainers. One thing I noticed was the D/P walkthrough just pulls the trainer and Pokémon data straight out of the pages of the routes and locations. While in yours and mine we had to do a little editing for it to fit in the template, which seems tedious but at the same time it doesn't take up so much space on the page. Should we just keep at that? I think that's one of the things that needs to be updated in the standards list.As for b. I think all the routes and locations should be listed on the normal appendix page despite the extra space.--Jello 18:10, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

I agree with b., since one of my secondary goals on wiki work is keeping it simple and create less hassle. Also a new surprise is that right now I am aware that another member of this project KCorp4000 whom I worked with before, has been working on new template designs in his sandbox for Trainers, Pokémon, and Items and it will be awhile. But once that is finalized then I will help out with the redesign upgrade, that is why I am also not updating any older template designs on earlier walkthrough parts for Ruby and Sapphire to avoid too much hassle. -Tyler53841 02:44, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Actually, that was EXACTLY what I was looking for/had in mind for template designs, since the one's that are currently used do take up a lot of space on the walkthrough pages. I wasn't aware there was someone working on those designs. I would love to see these get implemented soon. Do you know exactly how long it would take if it were to happen? I would also like to help out with the redesign upgrade. The completed walkthroughs so far could so some work too. --Jello 03:31, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

He'll contact me once he's done and got approval from the Editor in Chief TTEchidna. I have already been communicating with him to address any important flaws. But on this end I would want to help dealing with creating any good set of standard rules for this project to use to also help with quality of structure by using the best ideas that are feasible for use. -Tyler53841 04:12, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately, this project is somewhat neglected, though there is a core group of dedicated members who still contribute. However, I don't believe that it is an obsolete endeavor - why should Bulbapedia send viewers to Strategy Wiki, rather than be the one-stop site for the most accurate and in-depth information? Any given walkthrough can only be written so quickly, especially if only one or two people are working on it. The rather low number of active editors up against the sheer number of games that there are to cover is not a battle that can be won quickly, but persistence is key. I would know - since I first started editing for this project last July, I've since completed the guides for Red/Blue, Yellow, and Gold/Silver basically on my own. Walkthroughs are not encyclopedic articles, so like ForceFire said above, using "you" when referring to the player is permitted, though substituting that for "the player" or something similar would certainly help to make the walkthroughs look more in line with the rest of the wiki, and hopefully that would get it taken seriously. I don't know who described Elm as a geezer, but it's an opinion, and not the formal language we should really be using.

My opinions in response to your four points, Tyler:

• The editor's personal strategy has no place here. It is up to the reader to decide how they want to play the game - their strategy for raising or battling may be different. While the story always progresses the same way, there is no single greatest method to follow.
• The basic appendix pages should list every major location for a given subpage. While it may add a little extra to the page, it helps people track the storyline. If all that was listed was "Part # - From <here> to <there>", readers would have to guess if what they were looking for is in this section, or that one.
• Things that are less important should be mentioned briefly, if at all. A quick mention in the main body of a location's text is probably best for now. Things of lesser value on the first visit, but will play a larger role later on (like Ecruteak City, and later Tin Tower), should use the Later... heading to indicate that.
• Individual pages should try to keep it short. While they shouldn't be as short as possible, it's not great to let a page get too large either. </rant>
  

Like he said, I have been working on ideas in my sandbox to upgrade the way we present a locations data, specifically for Trainers, Pokémon, and Items. I'm pretty happy with how everything there looks right now. If anyone has any ideas or comments, please post them here. TTE basically has final say, but it's up to us to think something up. Those templates are what we'll hopefully use in all the walkthroughs, so if anyone has a way to improve something, just let me know. ;) --^KC 4000 19:38, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

I agree that is why I put down the fourth objects because it is also pointless to create too many or too few pages for each game. Take a look at section 1 of HeartGold and SoulSilvers' walkthrough which is pretty much very short. That is a reason why I suggested the fourth proposal to help the structure. -Tyler53841 00:01, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

I think there should be separate styles for different series, unless the style that's decided can be universally used by those that are done, those that aren't, and those that haven't been decided to have a walkthrough yet but should. I doubt that it'll be possible for Ranger to follow the same style as Mystery Dungeon or the main series. Besides, separate styles could make each walkthrough better as they'll fit right into the series. Also, this has nothing to do with style, but I think there should also be walkthroughs for Trozei!, Puzzle League and Challenge, the TCG video games, Poképark Wii, Hey You Pikachu! (if there is even a storyline. I remember there being missions, so the walkthrough could be divided by location), Pokémon Channel (same case as Hey You Pikachu!, though I don't know if there are missions) Mystery Dungeon Wiiware, the Pinball (same thing as Channel), Stadium series (Gym Leader Tower), and Snap (same thing as Channel), as well as other games that don't have walkthroughs but could. Turtwig A (talk | contribs) 03:15, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

LEADER!

I may have joined recently to the project, but we need a leader! Can someone at least take it over?! Spritemaster 2:00, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Actually, this project doesn't need a leader. It has set styles for each game, meaning there should be no problem. Turtwig A (talk | contribs) 02:55, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Then shouldn't the "no leader" header be taken out of the project page? --Jackowaco (talk) 16:51, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

heart gold/soul silver

well I could start doing a list of al the legendaries and where they are found, I know by experience that lots of people look for information like their location and how to get there.--Lapraslover 23:17, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

To write a walkthrough you'd need to start at the beginning. For specific facts, such as where legendary Pokémon can be found, we have encyclopedic articles. (I'd also advise you to follow the manual of style when writing for Bulbapedia). —darklordtrom 11:26, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Pokémon Emerald Walkthrough

On a walkthrough, what is the point where a section ends? Is it at a certain length, a part of the game, or something else? --Pokemon026

It depends, it shouldn't be too long a page nor too short a page. Try looking at other walkthroughs (such as the HGSS one) to give you an idea. A new section would be probably like entering a new city. —♥ Jello 00:55, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

That works. I might look another Gen III walkthrough for a clearer reference. --Pokemon026

I think the Jagged Pass would be a good stopping point. I'm going to see how much I can work on it. --Pokemon026

That's fine, just use your best judgment and thanks for working on it! —♥ Jello 01:09, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm probably looking too much into this, but some of the sections are just blurbs of text. That gives me something else to do, at least. --Pokemon026

If you need any help I'll be happy with the templates and stuff or minor things since I have a good amount of experience with them and can do it simple. I'll be heading down that way myself since only 5-6 areas of Ruby and Sapphire are left. Pretty much a few of these templates are so complex like the gym and rival battles in particular, that it is best to let an experienced user handle it since it is so easy to make a mistake which I'll be happy to put in to avoid these mistakes so if you need any help Pokemon026 I'll be glad to help since I have a copy of the game. -Tyler53841 01:28, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

That would be good. From what I can see, data for Pokemon and Trainers still needs to be written, and some sections could be written better. Maybe a to-do list of some sort? --Pokemon026

That's why I joined the routes and locations projects to coordinate with my walkthrough work which had done a few times including recently (with routes 129-134, with the aid of Microsoft Word that I very carefully used during lockdown). At the moment I am working on the rest of Meteor Falls and will carefully do the the trainers from Ruby and Sapphire for both the page and the walkthrough. -Tyler53841 01:49, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

Okay. I'm going to rewrite the first section (hopefully there's not a lot left here). Would a "to-do list" help get the pages up to a certain standard? --Pokemon026

I think if a lot of people knew what could be done, and pitched in, we could have a standard for the rest of the walkthrough very soon. I have put up a redesign to-do list on the main page; if there's a better place for it, please let me know. --Pokemon026

Don't know if it is necessary or not since for me I usually jot things down when I do my planning, but as the for the Emerald Walkthrough it is best to do an overhaul to see if things need to be moved to another section and so due to the whole size concept. Once I get done with Ruby and Sapphire I should have time to do one. -Tyler53841 03:14, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

That might work. The list is for people who might not know where to start. It would be good if we could get the walkthrough to a certain standard before continuing it. Anyway, I'm done for today, I may try to do more tomorrow. --Pokemon026

Lack of... lots of stuff

I have been looking through the walkthroughs, and the ones for Emerald, Diamond and pearl, and Platinum are all totally incomplete. Can we get these finished? LHCD~2 22:58, 3 August 2010 (UTC)