Talk:Ash's Charizard

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• Archive 1 (discussions from January 14, 2007 – January 4, 2009)

Ability

I'm not sure if it should be editted in, but since Charizard DO only have one ability, shouldn't Charizard's ability be listed as Blaze? Me and my fellow torchics agree on this - Sk8torchic. 16:27, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Unlike May's Blaziken and Ash's Chimchar, it has yet to show its ability in the anime. Yes, in the games, it has only one ability.. But since it's the anime, we are clueless of what the writers could do. D: ►Ҝəυzø8 16:30, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

If Charizard comes back in the D&P League then maybe they could have ash mention it while he is there - unsigned comment from MR115 (talk • contribs)

Steel Wing

Text says it used it in the fight against Kevin, table says in battle against Brandon. What's right? --×Impoleon xy× 16:40, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Protected?

Why is this page protected? I was just going to add a bit of trivia about it. Ghostkaiba297 07:08, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Someone keeps adding images. Try checking the article's history next time. :D ^tc²₆tc₂₆ 07:09, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Can an admin add that until Charizard Chills, Charizard only seems to want to obey Ash while fighting another Fire Pokemon? (Blaine's Magmar, Mewtwo's cloned Charizard, and Richie's Charmander) Ghostkaiba297 07:18, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Fly?

Unlike the situation with Ash's squirtle and Surf (Ash's squirtle has never outright used or was issued to use the move Surf) Ash's Charizard actually learned to fly with ash on its back in Charizards Burning Ambition. Although it has never been used in battle Charizard did explicitly learn it so should it be counted as a move it knows? -- D558 01:50, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

I agree. Also, unless I'm mistaken, Ash has commanded charizard to "Use Fly!" on multiple occosions, especially in Fighting Flyer with Fire. I think someone should add it. --GEN1KING 01:37, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Nope, this issue has already been resolved before. See here. --rockersk08 01:40, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Actually if you watch "Charizard Chills" Ash says "Charizard Fly" which can be taken as Charizard using the fly move to get up out of range of attacks but(if it was in the game) missing with the next attack. Though truth be told a lot of the moves in the anime are way different to the games as in the anime Pikachu's Agility and Quick Attack are pretty much the same as Pikachu has always hit the opponent when using Agility. So in truth we probably shouldn't list attacks at all since they could be inaccurate.--Lycos Ex Mortis 11:00, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

Mega Punch

I think it should be noted in the moves section that Ash commanded Charizard to use Mega Punch in Charizard Chills, which implies that he had learned it. --GEN1KING 05:07, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

Fire Spin?

Episode 32 of the season 1 The Ninja Poké-Showdown during the battle between Koga's Golbat and Ash's Charmander, was the first time Fire Spin was used by Ash's Charmander, not as Charizard in Fighting Flyer with Fire. - unsigned comment from Pookiemon (talk • contribs) --Pookiemon 21:51, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Charizard Disobeying Ash

Can someone put a picture of Ash's CHarizard ingnoring his orders? I uploaded one but the admins removed it.

Pedraito 22:43, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

• I agree, Charizard either disobeying or attacking Ash has been a huge part of its character and would be appropriate for an image to be placed on here of either one. I have one from AG189 that would work well, and it's in good quality... Johno1995 03:05, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

Uh, Oh...

Who changed the main picture of Ash's Charizard? I like it a lot better, but there was already a debate about this. I seriously hope this doesn't lead to another edit-war... --GEN1KING 04:11, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Charizard's Gender

Given that DP149 confirmed without a doubt that Pokémon of the same gender cannot fall in love then doesn't this mean that, due to the romance with Charla, Charizard is definitely male? Watchermark 16:57, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

In that case, we do have proof that Ash's Torterra is a male Pokémon but we can't put it until or unless it is clearly said or mentioned in the anime. ♫♪AdyNiz♪♫ 17:03, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

Look at this big note on the top bar of this discussion page.

Please don't post about Charizard's gender being unknown. It's very annoying. Our policy is that the gender stays unknown until someone in the anime calls it a male or female.

So, discussion ends here. Thank you. ♫♪AdyNiz♪♫ 17:06, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

Charizard's voice in EP271

I posted this at Talk:EP271, but figured that it would probably get more notice/traffic here. I was watching the raw version of EP271 (Ash's battle vs Harrison), and I noticed that the voice Charizard uses when it is sent out at the end is considerably different from the one used in the English dub in the same shot. As far as I'm aware Charizard's voice has been the same between the two versions throughout the series, with this one shot being the sole exception. Is there any information out there on who substituted Charizard's voice for this one shot, and why that change was made? It's probably worth noting in both articles if the information is out there. Matkin22 03:57, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Fly

So its not listed under moves anymore but there's a picture with a caption: "Using Fly". Should it stay there?--Burgundy 02:55, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Can't Edit

Is there a reason Charizard's page is locked, I can't find the edit button, so that's what I'm assuming has happened. There's just a minor grammer problem I was going to fix, nothing major. - Ash1Ketchum4 18:11, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

The page is not locked, and the Edit buttons are next to each section heading like they're supposed to be, along with the "edit this page" tab at the top of the page. —Minimiscience 18:31, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Actually the page is locked for unestablished users. Certain pages have been subject to edit wars by newly registered users so they're protected so only established users may edit. Just point out what you'd like fixed here and someone should take care of it. ^★Jo the Marten^★ ಠ_ಠ 18:35, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

No Problem, in the History section in the 6th paragraph one of the sentences says, "Liza occasionally visit the..." It should be "Liza occasionally visits the..." Again it's nothing major, just a grammatical error I noticed. Thanks. - Ash1Ketchum4 18:59, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Removed trivia?

I just noticed that this (relatively) recent revision removed a bunch of trivia that seems to be correct. Is there a reason why this was removed? AySz88 02:06, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

The reason the said trivia was removed was because we did a clean-out of all comparison trivia in articles expecially articles having to do with the anime. --Pokemaster97 02:25, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

Damian

On Damian's page the template of Charmander implies that it is male, despite on the main article, it says that Charizard's gender is unknown. Should I delete the male sign? --YoshisWorld 14:26, 14 July 2011 (UTC)YoshisWorld

Reopening the Fly discussion

Just a point of consistency on this website. Literally every single time a Pokemon is ordered to use its agility, this Wiki takes that to mean Agility, regardless of whether the Pokémon is able to use that move (Gary's Umbreon). However, in the battle between Charizard and Blastoise, Ash quite clearly ordered Charizard to "fly", which followed by Charizard flying into the air and then diving down to attack. Fly is obviously a hard one to place because of its status as a verb, but if we are classifying "agility" (which I maintain just means the same thing as "dodge it!") I believe that at least this instance should count for Fly. Toon Ganondorf (t c) 22:56, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Question

If Damian was Charmander's trainer, how does Ash was able to capture it? I mean, Damian was suppose to still have Charmander's pokéball, right? (and you can't capture a captured pokémon o.o --AfO 04:23, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

IIRC, Damien released Charmander.--ForceFire 04:27, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

I don't recall Damian officially releasing Charmander, but I think Pokemon can release themselves. Like they hint Snivy did, then the Frillish in BW037 releasing the contest Pokémon on her own. That being said, I think Charmander made it clear he didn't want to be Damian's Pokémon anymore, and released himself. ^★Jo the Marten^★ ಠ_ಠ♥ 04:31, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Rage

I've mentioned on Talk:EP105 about the Rage/Dragon Rage discrepency. However, if I'm agreed with, can someone please help find the true debut of Dragon Rage? Toon Ganondorf (t c) 07:59, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

Lock

Should we lock this page because of the rumor of the Charizard that appears in the N arc being Ash's Charizard? Iml908 (talk) 20:26, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

As of now, it's just a rumor, so I say no. But I think it'd be best to take it up with Kenji-girl. Ataro (talk) 20:32, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Unlock

Shouldn't we put at the top that it will be unlocked once the Kanto festival episode airs since it is now confirmed that it is indeed Ash's Charizard that returns that episode??RBK (talk) 18:19, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

BW116?

I can see why was the page locked (too many edit wars in this page), but you should have at least written "Ash' Charizard is going to reappear in BW116" already. It is confirmed! - unsigned comment from BlueWartortle (talk • contribs)

We don't do that for Pokémon (say that they are set to reappear in such episode), even if it is confirmed. PattyMan 01:32, 2 March 2013 (UTC)

Charizard finally used a Flying-type move. Is it trivia worthy?

In BW116, Charizard finally used a Flying-type move (Wing Attack) for the first time. Is it trivia worthy to mention that Charizard learned a Flying-type move almost 20 years and 727 episodes after his evolution back in Attack of the Prehistoric Pokémon? --PKMNAdventurer (talk) 17:16, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

If we did this for Charizard, then we'd have to do it for every dual-typed Pokémon in the anime that hasn't used a move of one of their types. R.A. Hunter Blade 22:49, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Left the Valley?

Is it safe to say at some point in time, Charizard finished its training in Charizard Valley and then went to Prof. Oak? Or is "speculation not allowed on this wiki"? Mr.Char (talk) 22:43, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

No. Apparently, Charizard was sent to Oak from the Valley, most likely because it couldn't Fly to Unova.--電禅Den Zen 22:55, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

No picture with Ash

How come there is no image "with Ash" here? like every other Ash's Pokémon's pages? --Pao27 (talk) 07:58, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

I believe there was an image at one time for "with Ash", but it may have been removed. I think that this image has enough images that an image for "with Ash" really isn't necessary at this time. --Pokemaster97 20:15, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Not all Ash's pokémon article have this and there are three pics featuring them together in the article. --HoennMaster 23:37, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Seismic Toss

So was the throwing move in today's episode, Seismic Toss??RBK (talk) 17:54, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

No, it wasn't even a move.--電禅Den Zen 21:32, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

Charizard's Gender (male):

In Pokémon official's site, I found a summary where it calls Charizard as a 'he': ChecK: http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/XOzelinkOX/media/1-1_zps639f37f7.png.html?sort=3&o=4 Also, watching BW season 2 episode 32 (where Charizards appears), there were many scenes where Ash addressed Charizard as 'he' and 'his'. LOOK: http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/XOzelinkOX/media/08b5c1b6-f5a4-4ba8-9a88-9783e2303b71_zpsb24742fa.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1 then at the right side there's a botton that says OPTION, click it and click DOWNLOAD and you'll see the image in full view.

All this plus Charizard's infatuation towards Charla (who's a female, wears a pink ribbon and has eyelashes). Indicate that he is male. --MsIsamisa (talk) 00:56, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

A) That website is for the dub only, not the original. We already note that it is confirmed male in the dub. B) Fan subs prove nothing. Gender pronouns do not exist in Japanese. C) While the infatuation strongly implies that it's male, it's still not concrete evidence. --ケンジのガール 06:09, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

If you said that 'We already note that it is confirmed male in the dub', then change the gender to male, then. --MsIsamisa (talk) 21:22, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

It's only listed as confirmed completely when it's confirmed in the original Japanese version. Otherwise it's listed as Charizard is now, unknown, but male in the dub. --It's Funktastic~!_{話してください} 21:25, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Hi, @Funktastic :): Check here: http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/XOzelinkOX/media/08b5c1b6-f5a4-4ba8-9a88-9783e2303b71_zpsb24742fa.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1 then at the right side there's a botton that says OPTION, click it and click DOWNLOAD and you'll see the image in full view.

That's just the fansubber's mistake. You cannot call anybody "he" or "she" in Japanese.--電禅Den Zen 21:32, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

I believe the note on the top of this page doesn't want us to post anything about Charizard's gender. PattyMan 21:41, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

I find it pretty odd, Charizard has many evidences that he's actually male, but anyways. --MsIsamisa (talk) 01:42, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Voice Actor/actress

Watching the recent episodes again, anyone noticed that Charizard's roars sound different from previous episodes? I don't think it's Shin'ichirō_Miki voicing him in BW. Hitmonchan107 (talk) 05:58, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

The credits for BW116 say he does voice it. --ケンジのガール 04:49, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Shinichiro Miki's voice has changed over time, between the last time he's voiced Charizard. I wondered that myself the first time I watched the subs, but it is in fact the same person as Kenji says. Gohan5 (talk) 09:51, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Moves Improvised

Should there be a double Flamethrower under the Moves Improvised section from BW121? I'm asking because it has a similar thing where Monferno and Cyndaquil used it in DP147. - unsigned comment from Mokes1995 (talk • contribs)

Info box Picture

Can we not get a better pic of Charizard from BW? One where he is closer to the "camera" and his face is shown? The picture isn't really consistent with the shots of his other Pokémon. - unsigned comment from Charmander4 (talk • contribs)

If we don't document on the strength of Ash's Pokémon, then...

Why is Charizard an exception to this rule? As it has been pointed out, noting the strength of a Pokémon is rather opinionated, which is not something we want. Shouldn't this be removed? He's here! The one and only...Uncle Edit! (talk) 20:27, 26 July 2014 (UTC)

Indeed. I've removed that paragraph, feel free to remove/reword anything I've missed. --Pokemaster97 20:35, 26 July 2014 (UTC)

Mega evolution

Should we try to protect it due to evidence like Sceptile of Mega Evolution? Jskylinegtr (talk) 07:56, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

Probably not, since there is no solid evidence that Ash's Charizard will be appearing soon or at the very least, Mega Evolving into Mega Charizard X/Y. Playerking95 (talk) 08:45, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

Present Location

There's nothing in the last BW episode implying Charizard stayed at Oak's lab. All we know is that he was there for a picture. Charizard could've very easily returned to the Charicific Valley... it's kinda like with Gliscor after the Lily of the Valley Conference, until that episode confirmed his whereabouts. So should we say Charizard's status is unknown? Pikatwig (talk) 16:34, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Oak's lab was Charizard's last known location, so that's what is on the page unless it gets confirmed otherwise. AGGRON989 20:13, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Gender again

It looks like a proof Charizard is male has actually existed for nearly 19 years. In the book that Dogasu is translating, Atsuhiro Tomioka (the most prominent and long-time writer of the anime) comments his episode EP105 with a sentence "Feel warm inside at the men's oath taken by Satoshi and Lizardon!". "オトコのちかい/Men's oath" is certainly emphasizing that both of them are male, otherwise Tomioka would've used another word or just "oath". This is also similar to how Axew, Scraggy, and Krokorok were confirmed male when they were called figurative brothers. I'm bringing this up to the talk page first mostly because of how controversial this subject has been.--電禅Den Zen 19:51, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

That was in Gen I before gender was implemented as a mechanic. Not proof unless there is proof Tomioka was aware of all the the Gen II mechanics. That phrase is also referring to people with machismo, not literal men. Otherwise he is assuming/it's Word of God and not canon --BlisseyandtheAquaJets (talk) 20:15, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Genders have always implicitly existed in Pokémon (Nidoran family, Cubone, Kangaskhan, Bye Bye Butterfree, ...), them not being a game mechanic is irrelevant. Tomioka is one of the main writers so whatever he says about the anime can be considered canon unless proven false. About the phrase, I'm still mostly sure "otoko no X" refers to literal men; there are better words for "manly", like "otokorashii". Can you find a counterexample involving a phrase "otoko no X" and a female?--電禅Den Zen 22:56, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

The title of the manga called Otoko no Isshou , for starters. And Word of God isn't canon. Unless the anime in its own universe says a thing is a thing, it isn't, because Word of God must be reflected in existing canon. That's why Scraggy and Butterfree aren't confirmed canon male as well and why Death Battle was wrong about Toph beating Gaara. Attract, Captivate, word in universe or nah. That's the rule:As an admin, you know this. Charizard could still be transgender, non-binary, lesbian(or gay, since Charla's name and their wearing a ribbon isn't proof either...I recommend that be re-looked at as well....). --BlisseyandtheAquaJets (talk) 02:25, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

...Come on. If the book is about the anime, it's certainly valid evidence. And if someone said that Ash and Charizard were swearing a man's oath in English, the immediate assumption would be that they're both male, and for good reason. (This is not different in the Japanese in question.) I don't say it's infallible reasoning, but it's absolutely not a case where we need to invent reasons for doubt; if there's some contradiction somewhere, fine, but until then, male should be absolutely logical. Tiddlywinks (talk) 03:47, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

We have never used supplemental material, or Tracey West's novelizations' many mistakes would be canon. I don't assume genders, because Force Fire and Kogoro said not to. Unless you're going to override their authority...The rule is the rule, and bending it further will lead to excuses for precedents for Pokémon like Totodile, Corphish, Heracross, Crobat and other similarly disputed genders, . Unless you'd care to rescind the Attract-Captivate(with one gender canon)-In-universe mention clause? Because if you do that, too many squabbles will happen. Charizard is unknown until it is mentioned in-universe(w/o Word of God), Attract/Captivate is used on it with one gender canon. I'm going to get Force Fire. --BlisseyandtheAquaJets (talk) 04:12, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

New evidence is really not something you can ALWAYS just dismiss out of hand. Sure, there are enough people out there who will think they have a new angle, when it really comes around to the same thing. But honestly, I'm quite willing to give Dennou Zenshi the benefit of the doubt that they have reasonable judgement here. (By which I mean, in something where I've not really known about any sort of history regarding this subject.) If you ask me, this is reinforced by their acknowledgement of "how controversial this subject has been". If you want to get ForceFire's attention, that's absolutely fine, but we shouldn't be presuming that the answer is DEFINITELY "no".

So I have a bit of an idea for the moment. Can we not assume I know exactly all of the things you're trying to refer to so that we might actually engage in productive/equal discussion?

Let's start with "Totodile, Corphish, Heracross, Crobat". Can you please explain in as much detail as possible the "problem" for these Pokemon?

Is the "Attract-Captivate [...] clause" related to the above? If not, can you explain why you think that has particular bearing on anything being discussed here?

And (just in case) if it's not part of the answers above, can you detail at least some of the "problems" with these Tracey West novelizations? Tiddlywinks (talk) 04:49, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

I'd like to apologize for my earlier attitude, first of all.

Totodile had a gender debate due to it falling in love with a Azumarill with a pink bow, that lead to a consensus that feminine bows do not equal female because of Piplup crossdressing.

Corphish, Crobat and Ludicolo are similar cases.

Heracross needs a settlement like Wobbuffet did, due to no obviously female Heracross appearing from Gen IV onward, because the anime could be pulling its own rules with gender differences.

The clause in question has been stated many times to be the official policy of Bulbapedia.

And as for Tracey West novelizations, that was an example of Word of God in action, since those were officially liscensed material related to the anime with a lot of errors ad continuity skips.

But, to avoid conflict, I'm going to duck out of this discussion. --BlisseyandtheAquaJets (talk) 17:55, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

So. OK. So much for discussion, I guess. I still kind of have questions about some of the above, I'm not sure they'd have bearing on this issue. But I guess if you're withdrawing from the issue it's kind of moot. Tiddlywinks (talk) 13:19, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

(resetting indent)Everyone knows and it is more than proven that Charizard is male. The problem is stubbornness.--Hikaru Wazana 13:55, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

If you'd like to be constructive, we're happy to listen. But if that's all you have, please restrain yourself. Tiddlywinks (talk) 13:45, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

What questions do you have about the above? Minus the Tracey West stuff, which I have explained was a bad example. --BlisseyandtheAquaJets (talk) 22:49, 4 May 2018 (UTC)

I think my questions were mainly about the Tracey West books and my uncertainty about the connection there, but you've disclaimed that one now.

The specific Pokemon mentioned are all just appearances/behaviors, which do not automatically mean anything absolute. You said originally that "bending the rule" (for Charizard here) would "lead to excuses" for those; but those cases are nothing like Charizard because (as far as you've explained, anyway) there is no extra material of any sort stating their gender. Accepting Charizard's gender based on Tomioka's comment in the book won't change anything for them.

If your issue with the Attract-Captivate clause perhaps boils down to "it must occur in the anime", that's being just a little too strict. You can consider that "clause" a tool of convenience. It's a very good, very convenient tool, but it doesn't necessarily account for/preclude every possiblity. We can't start off knowing every possibility to guarantee that it accouts for them all satisfactorily. Again, it's still a fine tool; 99% of the time that "clause" conveys exactly what we need to. But that doesn't mean we can never accept something else like, say, a promotional poster somehow, or a book. A discussion divorced from that "clause" is worthwhile when such new cases arise, based on the new source's own merits, and reasonably informed—but not automatically dictated by—past lessons. Tiddlywinks (talk) 02:12, 5 May 2018 (UTC)

Image Placements

Would like to gauge some opinions here. At the moment, an image of Ash and Charizard in Unova (featuring Ash in Black & White clothing) is found in the Johto section - this is because the image originally depicted Ash and Charizard in Johto, but years later it was replaced with a screenshot from the more modern season, without moving the file's location to the Unova section.

I figured a simple solution would be to just use both images in each respective season, to represent the more modern season and the more iconic season equally, without compromising either one of them - see here: [1]

However, my edits were reverted, with the same applying to a similar edit showing Ash and Infernape in both the Sinnoh League and their Journeys reunion, given that we have plenty of space + the importance of balancing modern artstyle with Infernape's more relevant season. The edit summary of the revert called it "unnecessary" in Infernape's case, and that "the old location was better" for Unova Ash in Johto, but I wouldn't want to leave it at that without checking other people's opinions - is there any reason why we can't just have more than one image to showcase more than one season? ToastUltimatum 19:57, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

We really only need one "Ash and <pokemon>" image. It really shouldn't matter which series is from. And we don't need an image from each series, because at some point, the articles are just gonna be bloated with too many images.--ForceFire 07:33, 9 November 2021 (UTC)