Talk:N

Create

So, why isn't there anything here? You could just put the basic stuff that is known about N, and a good picture, lock it, and that would make sure it's not flooded with speculation. I just feel like it seems very odd to have Bel and Cheren but not N. --ArcLumin 23:12, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

We have an article on him with known information. But not enough for a main space article. --Psy_ライダー☮ 23:15, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Ah. Hadn't noticed it, it doesn't come up very high on a site search. --ArcLumin 23:16, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

BP is having users create BW articles in their userspaces before being moved into the mainspace, which may explain that. --Psy_ライダー☮ 23:22, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Makes sense. Although there may be conflicting articles when BW gets released. Oh well, it's not a big deal. --ArcLumin 23:26, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Missing Battle

You're missing a battle between Raimon City and the final match. I fought him in the Magnetic Cave and he used a team including Giar and Denchura's pre-evo. Wish I could give you more but that's what I remember. --The Great Butler 02:59, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Legendaries

-does a double take at that- um, shouldn't there be some trivia on his article about him being the only trainer not part of some battle facility to use Legendary Pokémon against the player or something?--Darknesslover5000 05:38, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Well there is Greevil..but that doesn't count now does it? Ataro 05:42, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

To settle it once and for all!

Like --The Great Butler said, there is another missing battle with N which takes place at route 6, in the cave. His team is: Gantoru lv. 28, Bachuru lv. 28, Giaru lv. 28 and Tesshido lv. 28. Here is a video of the battle: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehV6YGzcPJc&feature=related. Now could Someone PLEASE add this to the article? User:TheBlackPokemonMaster

You have to understand that we need not only the Pokemon he uses, but their entire movesets, too. We'll get to it when we get to it. I'm almost there in my game, so I'll do it then if someone doesn't beat me to it. 梅子^❀_✿ 18:45, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Champion?

It's never said in the game if he ever won this title. It seems he only battled Adeku and did not battle the Elite Four before and that he didn't want to be a Champion, as he wanted to make every trainer release their Pokémon after his victory over Adeku. But he did defeat all of Adeku's team and them claimed to be way stronger than the champion. Also, it isn't show the moment of registration of your team into the Hall of Fame, but the PC does register the team of your first time clearing the Pokémon League... So I have this doubt about his status when you last meet N.KurowaSan 08:19, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

He's not the Champ...Ataro 08:21, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Trainer Sprite

Hmm... {look look look} Correct me if I'm wrong/rude, but was it not agreed upon that although Pokémon sprites were to remain animated .png files (and as such static in some browsers), Trainer sprites would be animated .jpeg files (and as such animated in most browsers)? - unsigned comment from Giratina's Embodiment (talk • contribs)

.jpeg/.jpg do not and never have been animated. I think you meant .gif. This sprite isn't even animated, it's just a normal static sprite. —♥ Jello^talk 23:56, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

I KNEW I got the wrong file type! Anyways, sorry, I noticed that although N has animated sprites ingame, the picture was inanimate, and since it was a .png, I came to the logical (although incorrect) conclusion that it was an animated .png, hence why it wouldn't animate in IE.Giratina's Embodiment - Please don't hurt us... 00:05, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Harmonia

I found this name in several Japanese websites and the Japanese Wikipedia and mentioned something it about N's surname. Is this confirmed? 神奇超龍 13:59, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

• I personally can confirm Geechisu mentions the "Harmonia Lineage" in his pre-battle rant, so I'd say it's confirmed. Carrottime 23:38, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Please Expand N's Bio in the games.

N exists as an antagonistic character, appearing before the player at several points during the game to battle. Despite his aspirations, he refers to Pokémon as "friends".

I say this needs to be expanded. It's very short and needs more clarification on how his childhood goes, how his father made him the leader of Team Plasma and how his father is using him for his schemes. It needs to be more clarified.Duo2nd 01:20, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

English name

I'm pretty sure his English name was confirmed as N. I noticed that it was added to the intro and removed. Why is this? This image clearly lists his name as N. Or is this because the name N is not matched to this character, despite it clearly being him. --SnorlaxMonster 05:05, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

See here Ataro 05:20, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

I did. "N" is clearly written in the text, not distorted like the elemental monkeys' names. Besides, the big difference between that situation and this is that this does not require moving. Moving pages then relinking everything is a long process, and it is not good if it turns out to be wrong (especially for Pokémon). For this, it is adding 8 characters to the page (including the space and bolding). --SnorlaxMonster 05:26, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Plasma Spoiler

Is there a way we could change the opening sentences of this article to remove references to Team Plasma? I mean, yeah, him being the leader isn't the real spoiler among other things, but he's not linked to Team Plasma until his 3rd battle with the player or so, right? Could we change it to be like "N is a trainer in Black and White who battles the player regularly" or something to that effect?--Purimpopoie 01:51, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

It's spoiled in the opening that he's part of Team Plasma (it contains Ghetsis and the Team Plasma logo, which are seen in Accumula Town before you even meet N). As for being the leader, being crowned by them implies that he is at least very high ranking. Regardless, Bulbapedia does not generally avoid spoilers, other than with soft redirects and the {{spoiler}} template, which is now at the start of this article. --SnorlaxMonster 09:39, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Also, I think that people who avoid spoilers simply don't read Bulbapedia articles on such character. We're an encyclopedia, our informations are supposed to be complete. Someone who reads Bulbapedia should know the risk of being spoiled. We're not an official-ish website that gives just superficial teaser informations about the games. We're an encyclopedia. --Maxim 09:46, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Well if we're using a spoiler template at the top, would anyone else think it wise to change his name to N Harmonia? Ghetsis does mention that they share the same name, even if it turns out they aren't related. Blazios 10:09, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

But N obviously isn't his full name, so I wouldn't do that. If we ever get to know his real first name, I think a move would be possible. --Maxim 10:11, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

I think it should be mentioned in the opening paragraph that his surname is Harmonia, but I agree with Maxim that we don't know that N is his first name (and I believe I read somewhere that it is confirmed to stand for something). --SnorlaxMonster 10:14, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

I... didn't actually mean to move the page, I just intended for the opening paragraph and infobox to be updated, like Ghetsis. Blazios 10:43, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

I don't think the page should be moved either. I believe what Maxim was saying was that we would move it when we find out what his first name is. --SnorlaxMonster 10:44, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Last battle team order

Since he uses Zoroak order of his team is important. I'm certain that his Zoroark was disguised as Klinklang in my battle with him, which means it's in his last slot. — ∀ЫъГѣ ∃Talk page 15:28, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

That was the case for me as well. The way the page had it had me thinking it would be disguised as Vanilluxe. - unsigned comment from Missingno. Master (talk • contribs) 19:16, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Technically, the champion

N does battle the Elite Four to get to Alder; they comment on how the player certainly isn't the first challenger they fought that day, and N does defeat Alder fair and square (enough to make Alder beg N to reconsider his goal). While he is not "proclaimed" champion and doesn't take the title, he's still as much a champion as the player is after beating champions in past games. This much should at least be acknowledged. Luna Tiger * the Arc Toraph 17:35, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

"You said you have a dream..."

Conjecture: N's last words vary depending on how you answered when he asked you if you had a dream at Chargestone Cave. If you said "yes," you get the scripts currently given in the article; if you said "no," in White you get what was in the article prior to this edit, and in Black you get the script that I wrote down in my playthrough:

Dream your dream!

Follow the path of truth to make that
dream a reality, and someday
you will achieve all that you dreamed of!

Well, then...

Farewell!

This would explain the discrepancies between the various last words given in the article (and the one I have). Can anyone check if this theory is correct? —Minimiscience 02:52, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

It is correct. The article lacks the two "No" scripts you refer to, in order to include all four scripts for the two scenarios. Nechifor 09:09, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Name origin

The name for 'N' could mean more than just the Latin letter; N's frequent mathematical references in his speech (such as formulas) suggest an origin to the common variable given to the set of natural numbers (see this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_number ). What to make of a connection between N and natural numbers is speculation (although they go to infinity much like the surface area of his Menger sponge on his belt), but would it be fair enough to at least add to his name origin that this refers to a common variable used in mathematics? Chicobo329 00:27, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

En Harmonia

"N Harmonia" sounds (exactly) like "en harmonia," which is Spanish (and probably a few other romance languages) for "in harmony." Could this be the name origin? ----Zewis (29) 22:02, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

"enharmonic" is already listed as an origin. It's more likely than the Spanish for "in harmony," seeing as his theme is composed almost entirely of enharmonics. --Andy^P_K^M_N (talk) 12:21, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

How do you know that he's Ghetsis' son or relative?

I don't think that it was even stated in the game. I'm temporarily removing that sentence that says that he's Ghetsis' only son till I see some proof. Blueknightex 04:57, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Ghetsis#At N's Castle. First quote in the "After N is defeated" bullet point. Generally, and the way he's saying it, having the same last name implies that they are related. Also, if N is not Ghetsis's biological son, he is his adopted son. "Father" does not explicitly have to mean a biological relationship. Werdnae (talk) 05:29, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Well we could change the sentence around a little bit. Besides we're not quite sure that he is 'directly' related to N as the game did not state that. One of the Seven Sages also said this despite the quote from Ghetsis' that you showed me. Blueknightex 11:42, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Actually N is his son. I'm playing the Japanese version of Pokemon Black, and in the castle the word Ghetsis uses to adress him is 'musuko' (息子) (even though he puts 'me' right after it, giving it a very rude, derogatory edge). This word is only used for your own son (otherwise it would be 'musuko-san') and does not have a secondary meaning like the English word 'son'. You do not throw it around, unless you really mean it; and considering the fact that Ghetsis was enraged at this point in the game, it's quite surprising he didn't deny him, given his character (but where would the plot twist be then?); and even if he had been pretending, there was no reason for him at this point to keep his façade up. Just the fact he used this word, even though he clearly didn't think highly of N, says a whole world about their relations. I don't remember N saying 'Father' anywhere in the game though.Frundan 10:19, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

N's eyes

at N's coronation, it clearly shows his eyes are blue. it is the only color that cannot be argued with solid evidence.

people say his eyes are green. not once have i seen an official picture where his eyes are that color. i myself am unsure where that came from.

others say they're gray. it seems that way, yes, but is it not because there is always a shadow over his eyes? even on the manga cover N is shadowed so that his eyes appear gray.

but like i said, in the coronation scene, it shows a close-up of them blue as the sky. i have yet to find a reason why they would appear that way if they were any other color.

.beautiful.intentions 20:12, 16 June 2011 (UTC) Ally

Have a look at this official artwork image, they're green. ♫♪エイディニズ♪♫ 10:29, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

I checked the opening. And they are indeed blue. And it's kinda hard to tell what color they are in the artwork. But I would like to point out that Silver's eyes are red in the opening but grey in the artwork and sprites. This could be the same thing. --ケンジのガール 10:44, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

sorry, i'm still not seeing green there at all, and still dont get how you can get green from any of the official pictures of him. and i think silver's eyes are only red there to match the color scheme at that particular point of the opening.

.beautiful.intentions 04:27, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Yes, Harmonia again!

If the Japanese Games state that they are father and son (as stated above), then should that be definitive? The English hints at it, but never goes into it, and at the moment, when I hover over the word "father", about six lines worth of text comes up. Would it be better to have:

Relatives | Ghetsis (Father)

And likewise on Ghetsis's article:

Relatives | N (Son)

It's not too important, just an idea. I doubt we'll get a better understanding until the third game (if there will be one), and I didn't want to do it without running through the talk first. Samjohn95 12:18, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

I agree. This is a similar situation to Silver and Giovanni, where in the Japanese games it is confirmed, but only hinted in the English games. Sure, Giovanni and Silver are father and son in Adventures too, but that isn't why we do that the way we do. --SnorlaxMonster 14:47, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

N eyes are officially Blue/Gray

I enlarged and colour-picked the one in the article and they are grey; the same colour is used in his mugshot and in the official illustrations from the artwork released with the game by Ken Sugimori and the same colour is used in Pokemon Special. In the sprite his eyes are covered by his hairbangs so his pupils are only a single black pixel.

You can see Ken Sugimori artworks here and here, you can see the ones in the article compared here

There is no official illustration that depicts him with Green eyes.LurKasumi 07:32, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

His real name

His real name is apparently Natural Harmonia Gropius. Master Lucario 14:27, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Wow. I'm not sure if I like the name, but it's awesome that it's revealed. Now waiting for his English name (may or may not be the same) and other languages. Hopefully we'll see this name in "Grey". Anyhoo, could someone translate this entry in its entirety? --Maxim 14:55, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Apparently the nickname N also stands for "Natural number", which makes sense given his Menger sponge and his maths...iness. - Blazios _talk 15:11, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Possibly Walter Gropius, one of the pioneering masters of modern architecture. But considering his childhood and his action, Gropius sounds a bit disturbing.--超龍_「對話」 18:43, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Someone on Serebii translated it:

"Let me introduce part of the initial establishment of N --from here-- Real name is Natural Harmonia Gropius. N comes from Natural Number. N exceeds humans. His IQ is strangely high. He excels at maths enough to be called a magician of mathematics. A genius. Quick-witted. Has extreme mood swings. He can see the past and future of persons. There are rumours that perhaps he was born from a Pokémon. (Parents are unknown.) He loves Pokémon plenty, keeps distance from humans. He believes himself to be perfect. His ideology is to always put pokemon first and foremost. Since he is so unwordly, he's been feared by humans. Therefore, he has a very strong connection to Pokémon. --to here-- etcetera, etcetera..."

So yes, it is his real name, not just a name origin. There's also a lot of interesting trivia in there.- Blazios _talk 19:12, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Hey, I can read Japanese and it totally does say that. Do you guys just not want it in the article because Serebii got to the info first or something? --Transfinite | Talk 05:00, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

No. Ataro 05:04, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

So why? What makes a staff member's blog less of a reliable source than a staff member's Twitter account? --Transfinite | Talk 05:10, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Age

How old is N? --Modikisha 16:33, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

It was never revealed. Ataro 16:51, 18 October 2011 (UTC)