Talk:Trio master

Don't you think this is overdoing it a bit? -Happy Mask Man 17:24, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

I agree. This reads a bit more like fanfiction/fan terminology than anything. --Zeta 17:50, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Eh, I figured it needed to have a name. After all, there is a definite relationship between the birds and Lugia, the beasts and Ho-oh, and the Regis and Regigigas.

Think it should just be a subpage of Legendary trio? Tom Temprotran 20:35, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Forget a subpage, just merge it into the main trio article as a section. That article is short anyway. --WikidSmaht 09:09, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

So, uh, when's something going to be done about this silly article? -Happy Mask Man 01:17, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Arceus

Isn't Arceus the master of Trio masters?--KukiTalk 16:31, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

All we know is it's the master of the lake trio. Ho-Oh, Lugia, and Regigigas... well, they actually seem to be overlords of sky, sea, and land. TTEchidna 16:45, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

i thought Groudon, Kyogre, and Rayquaza were the overlords of the land, sea, and sky. I kind of pictured Ho-Oh and Lugia as guardians. and i'm not even sure what to think of Regigigas as of yet. InuMimi 12:39, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Remember that while Kyogre expanded the seas, Groudon expanded the continents, and Rayquaza brought neutral ground (and not ground as in Groudon, but you get what I mean) with the sky, they are very much beings of these domains, and have never been shown to watch over the effects of the domains they represent. Rayquaza may keep the balance between Kyogre and Groudon, but it seems to simply be a leader of the Sky World, rather than its Guardian. The Hebrew mythological/legendary/Biblical creatures known as Behemoth, Leviathan, and Ziz are seen as the Great Beasts of the Earth, Sea, and Sky (respectively), but not as the Guardians of these domains. They simply are the Greatest of the inhabitants of these domains. I'm not saying that Pokémon has to adhere to the stories that its Legendaries are based on, but they do provide a hint. Now, granted, Kyogre and Groudon's information in the version they do not appear in is important in that is states that Kyogre brought the relief of rain to those caught in drought, and Groudon brought and end to the monsoon-like rains that tormented various regions. But these are born from aspects of their nature - the ability to expand the seas or earth with Drizzle and Drought respectively. This would seem to state that Kyogre is actually the guardian of the Earth - as it brought balance back to regions suffering drought, the negative aspects of Groudon - and that Groudon is the guardian of the Seas, for precisely the equal and opposite reasons. Of course, they are not the guardians of each others' domains, though they do keep each other in check somewhat, when they're not sleeping, that is. And when they are both awake - well it seemed that they actually didn't want to fight each other in the games at least, and that it was the Orbs that drove them out of control. The citizens of Sootopolis in Emerald state that the two look like they actually don't want to be fighting each other, as if they are being forced to by the Red and Blue Orbs (which may or may not be man-made). And Rayquaza has been seen to keep them in check when this does happen (though somehow Lance and Ash and co. were able to stop them without Rayquaza in the anime). But even Rayquaza has been seen as very defensive of its area - in Movie 7 it attacked Deoxys on sight simply because Deoxys entered it's domain. That's more like an attack dog than a guardian trying to keep the balance of the skies.

Lugia has shown multiple times that if it existed in the sky, it would cause catastrophic events that could effect the entire world, but by maintaining its powers beneath the sea it is able to keep the balance of the world's water, and therefore the source of life (as seen in a traditional Buddhist sense, as well as in, say, Movies 1, 2, 4, 5, and 9). Ho-oh has been seen as the maker of Rainbows and the being that ends the storms that could cause pain and suffering to the world, so it is the guardian of the Sky World. Ironically, the Legendary Birds and their actions affect the sea and are governed by Lugia, while the Legendary beasts are governed by Ho-oh.

The Regi trio seem to have been made by Man, the class of beings often associated with the Earth, as bone and muscle and flesh are very Earthy substances. But Regigigas has been known as the being that pulled the Continents together by towing them with ropes, and it is also seen in Movie 11 as providing its phenomenal strength and its mastery over the great beasts that walk the Earth (here being Mammoswine) to prevent catastrophes such as that of the Glacidia glacier moving and causing much devastation across the Earth. Regigigas is perhaps the most Deus ex Machina a Pokémon movie character could get (though Kyogre in Movie 9 comes close), as he basically solves the final crisis of the movie, when Ash and co. couldn't. Regigigas' role of herding Megafauna is very Earth-based as well - see the Ground egg group, and it's role with Mammals (or HSOWA). Mammals almost define Earth and its denizens, though they certainly are not the only ones; but their association with humans and agriculture and also with the ancient Megafauna that dominated this world in the early Cenozoic are definitely indications that Regigigas is like a human of the ancient world, and how humans see themselves as the Stewards of Earth (or at least should...).

So my point here is that while Groudon, Kyogre, and Rayquaza represent the elemental energies that empower the three domains of Earth, Sea, and Sky, respectively, it is Regigigas, Lugia, and Ho-oh (again respectively) that are the stewards of these domains. Groudon, Kyogre, and Rayquaza represent a trio (though a statistically imbalanced trio as Rayquaza is stronger than the other two), but one without a Trio Master because they keep each other in-balance ability-wise (and if Kyogre has some possible connection with "the Beast of the Sea", than it may be that the Trio Masters each keep the Weather Trio member in their domain balanced as well, though that's getting more into speculation). Regigigas, Lugia, and Ho-oh are Trio Masters because of their Pokédex and series lore about their roles, which connect them with both the Trios they control and their domains of Land, Sea, and Sky. The association with Lugia and the Moon and Ho-oh and the Sun - that's another story that has absolutely no basis save the opening screens of Silver and Gold versions.

Arceus has yet to have been shown as the Master of Trio Masters, as has he yet to have been shown as the Master of the Dragon Trio (though this will probably be revealed next summer with Movie 12). So until then, Arceus remains as the Trio Master of the Lake Trio, only. But having created the entire world and its planes, I would assume he could be considered the master of the Weather Trio, the Dragon Trio, as well as relegating the Beast Trio, Bird Trio, and Regi Trio to Ho-oh, Lugia, and Regigigas. That, however, is speculation for now. Thank you for your time. Satosuke 03:53, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Arceus

Isn't he the trio master of the dragons as well.We know for sure he created Dialga and Palkia (and he probably created Giratina to start the reverse world but that is just speculation) which is like how Ho-oh created the Beasts and Ho-oh is the beast master so Arceus should be noted as the Dragon Trio Master or as Master of Dialga and Palkia. Sailor Earth 16:22, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

True, but if he's only the master of Dialga and Palkia, then he's not a Trio Master, just a Duo Master, so to speak.

Please add your sig with the four tildes after you comment. Arceus is almost certainly the Trio Master of the Dragon Trio as well; however, his relationship with Giratina is still not yet confirmed, while it's been established that he either created Dialga and Palkia or else they are warring aspects of himself (sorry for using the masculine noun-forms). Until Movie 12 comes out, we probably won't have an answer to that, so for now, Arceus remains only as the Trio Master of the Lake Trio. Satosuke 03:56, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

lake trio master

in the Pokémon Pearl PokéDex data itt says the followinng : It is thought that Uxie,Mesprit and Azelf all came from the same egg. Is it the egg that Arceus came from or another legendary Pokémon ?--Nobody777 12:58, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Who knows, It might've been an egg fromm mew? --Force Fire 13:08, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Ah Ah Ah Ah...

What about deleting this article? Come on, this is just random observation with fanwanked explanation. We don't need article about this! --Maxim 17:08, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

A little late, but this should merged into the legendary trio article. Anyone oppose? MK 03:12, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Naw, it's a good article. It could be fleshed out a bit more, and after Movie 12, it will probably be bigger with the Dragon Trio added. I say keep it for now. Satosuke 03:58, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

I agree with Maxim here. The article is inconsistent and attempts to reveal patterns that don’t exist. Lugia definitely isn’t the master of the birds in the games, for example, and Ho‐oh is not the master of the beasts in the anime (AFAIK; bear in mind that I haven’t watched the show in years). The fact that we repeat Rayquaza really shows that this is just shoehorning. Legendary trios this is not. IIMarckus 22:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Lake Trio Giratina

I'm starting to think that the lake trio is led by Giratina. After all, they did kinda summon him and lead the player to him and he appears in the fourth lake of Sinnoh. This is purely speculation but so are the others, except the Golems.Shadow1337 23:57, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Yeah good points, I think you could be right yknow. --Guardian of Earth |SGMS 2010 20:58, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Possibly, however, it clearly states that Arceus created the Lake Trio himself. Satosuke 21:18, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Isn't Arceus the master of two trios?

I'm pretty sure he's the master of the Dragon trio too. Master Lucario

As Unown Lord said, "It is one thing to claim that Dialga, Palkia and Giratina constitute a trio, but going as far as suggesting that Arceus created Giratina is simply unfounded and will be avoided until proven in-game."--Kkllnn blastoise 22:34, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

As I've said numerous times throughout this talk page, we'll get our answer most likely in Movie 12. Wait until then. Satosuke 04:47, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

In Platinum, it said that Giratina was the member that "no one talked about." You can't create two members of a trio without creating the third, especially when the third is basically a parallel universe! TorchicBlaziken ^{(talk•edits)} 13:18, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

No proof for Giratina...?

...I recall in Pokemon Platinum, at the Spear Pillar, Cynthia states that Giratina was created alongside Dialga and Palkia, though never talked about...- unsigned comment from M190049 (talk • contribs)

It isn't a trio master.--RexRacer -talk 21:25, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

...I didn't say it is. In the text, it says "According to legend, Arceus created Dialga and Palkia. Whether Arceus created Giratina or not is unknown."

...It kind of confirms this in Platinum.

~m190049^~talk 21:47, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

With the facts, it seems Arceus DID in fact create Giratina. It does kinda confirm it in Pt...--DRAGONBEAST^X 21:50, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Okay than. I'll remove the sentence. ~m190049^~talk 21:55, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

M'kay, I removed it and replaced it with a new one. ~m190049^~talk 22:08, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

I think that this chart would be better

I'm just not sure wether or not you'll agree.

Trio	Master	Relation
File:Legendary birds.jpg Legendary Birds	Lugia	Lugia rises to quell the fighting of the legendary birds in The Power of One, and is the only one who is able to do so.
Legendary Beasts	Ho-Oh	After the three legendary beasts perished in the fire at the Brass Tower, Ho-Oh revived them.
File:GenIII Battle.jpg Weather Trio	Rayquaza	Rayquaza may internally be the master of the weather trio, primarily because it had quelled the fighting between the other members of its trio in Pokémon Emerald.
File:Regis.png Legendary Golems	Regigigas	Regigigas will awaken on bringing the three legendary golems to Snowpoint Temple. Regigigas' Pokémon Platinum Pokédex entry also claims that it built statues made of rocks, ice, and magma.
File:Dialga-Palkia-Giratina.jpg Dragon Trio	Arceus	According to legend, Arceus created Dialga and Palkia, and it's stated in Pokémon Platinum that Giratina was created alongside them, thus completing the dragon trio. All four legendary Pokémon will battle in the 12th Movie, Arceus: To a Conquering Spacetime.
File:MespritAzelfUxie.jpg Lake Trio		Arceus is also said to have created the lake trio whilst creating the universe, making Arceus the only trio master that is related to two legendary trios rather than just one.

This chart is smaller and less image heavy, and it's a little more convenient if your looking for the master of a certain trio. Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 20:27, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

The fact that the images clash with each other turns me off on the idea. -Sketch 20:57, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

What do you mean by clash together? Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 13:35, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

They don't look good together. Also, it is hard to see which trio is which; they all just look like blurs of color at that resolution. With that said, the point of an article is to read it and not just look at the pictures, so how about we do just that. If one reads the column title it shouldn't be a problem. Not to mention the master is the first in the row, and therefore the one the eye should first travel to. — THE TROM — 21:19, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

They look fine to me. I can see the images just fine.And do you realy think that every pokémon in every trio should be shown? Isn't this article about the masters? Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 23:52, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Uh...yeah? That's what that column is for. The images are all of varying quality too. The Bird Trio and Lake Trio are screenshots and the others are official art. The The Regi art is the worst of them all: anime image on a white background. If we use this, just the their menu sprites in there.

Trio	Master	Relation
Legendary Birds	Lugia	Lugia rises to quell the fighting of the legendary birds in The Power of One, and is the only one who is able to do so.

And if you do this, make sure all three sprites are on the same row...not like how I have it there with Moltres on it's own line. -Sketch 11:10, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

You know, Sketch, you might have an idea there. The Master is larger than the pokémon in the trio, which makes it the first thing you see, and the trio pokémon are small and almost unnoticeable. One thing's for sure, it's better than mine. Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 21:02, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

What.

A quote from the Trivia: "Lugia is the only trio master who did not debut in the same generation as its trio."

What about Regigigas? It's from Gen. IV and its trio is Gen. III. Reign 01:23, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Has been removed. You know, you are allowed to take out this stuff yourself. —darklordtrom 21:38, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Ehh...Every edit I make someone reverts and tells me not to do it again, I decided to take the safer route here. Reign 09:10, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Arceus the double master

Isn't Arceus really the master of all the trios? CuboneKing 17:00, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Well, Arceus is the master of two trios but he can boss all the other masters about. Lunick v sonela 17:07, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Lugia

Was Lugia's relation to the other three birds ever mentioned in any of the games? Or is it just anime exclusive? I don't remember there being any mention of it in the original GSC games, but is there anything about it in the remakes? Morgil27 17:59, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

It's in Mystery Dungeon R/B. —darklordtrom 20:55, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Ah, i see. I haven't played any of those Mystery Dungeon games. But aren't they in an entirely different world then the main games and anime, though? Morgil27 21:08, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Real History

I'm from Portugal and when they distributed Arceus for Diamond, Pearl and Platinum versions the gave me a booklet telling the history. I quote:

Arceus is regarded as the Pokémon God, the creator of the Pokémon universe.

This is a legendary Pokémon, Alpha species and normal type. Though, if it have some elemental plates it can be transformed in one of 17 types of Pokémon. This is its powerful multi-type ability.

The story goes that Arceus was born from an egg in chaos even before the outbreak of the cosmos.

Arceus began creating Pokémon to put everything in place. The first thing he did was to create Mew to take account of the universe, this one and Arceus are the Pokémon that accompanied the formation process of the cosmos.

Then he had to create Shaymin so that nature arise and to maintain balance. Arceus created Dialga, which in turn gave rise to time, and Palkia, which led to the space. Giratina created to control the death and, if necessary, act as mediator between Dialga and Palkia.

After that, it created Jirachi that put the stars on firmament. Once created light, thanks to Jirachi, immediatly Darkrai could be seen in Arceus' shadow. Arceus thought to give a mystic touch to the universe and created Cresselia, the first Pokémon with feelings. This created the moon and, thanks to the feelings, wanted some help and company, so it created the legendary trio formed by Uxie, Mesprit and Azelf and later the Clefairy. This legendary trio was later charged with providing living beings with feelings, like emotion, knowledge and will, basic features that represent each. Welcome to the Pokémon Universe.

That means Arceus created Mew, Shaymin, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, Jirachi and Cresselia. Cresselia created Clefairy, Uxie, Mesprit and Azelf. Darkrai was created by Arceus' shadow.

For people who knows portuguese:

Arceus é considerado como o Pokémon Deus, criador do universo Pokémon.

Trata-se de um Pokémon lendário, da especie Alpha e de tipo Normal. No entanto, se possuir algumas das elemental plates pode transformar-se num dos 17 tipos de Pokémon. esta é a sua poderosa capacidade multi-tipo.

Reza a história de que Arceus nasceu de um ovo imerso no caos ainda antes de eclodir o cosmos.

Arceus começou a criar Pokémon para colocar tudo no seu lugar. A primeira coisa que fez foi criar Mew para que tomassse conta do universo, pelo que este último e Arceus são os Pokémon que acompanharam o processo de formação do cosmos.

Depois teve de criar Shaymin para que a natureza surgisse e para manter o equilibrio. Arceus criou Dialga, que por sua vez deu origem ao tempo, e Palkia, que deu origem ao espaço. Criou Giratina para que controlasse a morte e, se necessário, agisse como mediador entre Dialga e Palkia.

Posteriormente criou Jirachi que colocou as estrelas no firmamento. Uma vez criada a luz, graças a Jirachi, imediatamente foi possível ver Darkrai na sombra de Arceus. Arceus pensou dar ao universo um toque místico pelo que criou Cresselia, o primeiro Pokémon com sentimentos. Este criou a lua e, graças aos seu sentimentos, desejou ter ajuda e companhia, pelo que criou o trio lendário formado por Uxie, Mesprit e Azelf e posteriormente os Clefairy, este trio lendário ficou encarregue de mais tarde dotar os seres vivos de sentimentos, como a emoção, a sabedoria e a vontade, cracterísticas básicas que representam cada um dele. Bem-vindo ao universo Pokémon. - unsigned comment from SakasFixe (talk • contribs)

Sounds like fanfiction.

Please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). 梅子^❀_✿ 20:08, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Well, it's not fanfiction because it's real. When I read it for the first time I was confused too, but... it also says how to receive Arceus and it's caracteristics:

Pokédex nr. 493 Specie: Alpha Type: Normal Ability: Multi-Type High: 3,2 m Weight: 320,0 kg Level: 100 Experience points: 1.250.000 Object: Baya Magua (Magua Berry) - unsigned comment from SakasFixe (talk • contribs)

Could you possibly show us a scan or pics of this pamphlet?

Please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). 梅子^❀_✿ 20:44, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm calling unofficial until GameFreak of Japan says something like this. "Giratina was created to control death"? If I'm nto mistaken it was confirmed to be antimatter some time ago. Reign 20:48, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

How can I Ulpoad pictures to Bulbapedia?

I knew about the control of antimatter but, I'm good in Particule Phisics, if Giratina controls Antimatter it must be made of antimatter and he couldn't come to our world or we to its.

--Sakas 18:26, 13 April 2010 (UTC)SakasFixe

Ok forget it.

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I don't think you understand the nature of our request to see scans/pics. We want to see the part that proves that it is officially endorsed by Nintendo.

Please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). 梅子^❀_✿ 02:04, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Ok! These pics were taken with my DSi and, I don't know why, only three pics are jpeg, others are the symbol of Nintendo, Cover of the booklet and back cover. Thoses pics was, like the others, transfered for facebook and the format is png

I will try to convert them

Sakas 19:49, 14 April 2010 (UTC)SakasFixe

Ok I get it

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I'm still doubtful of it. It's stated in the games that the lake guardians were made by Arceus, along with Dialga and Palkia (and Giratina, too, as Cynthia reveals). Nintendo knows their legends. TTEchidna 01:52, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

So why did they created that story? It is real! Trust me! I know it seems weird but that's what is written there. I understand your position. You can ask Nintendo. And... where is stated in the games that they are a creation of Arceus? Sakas 17:43, 25 May 2010 (UTC)SakasFixe

well that means that Crescelia is a the trio master of the pixie trio, denouncing Arceus as their trio masters, that also means that the trio hatched from the same crescelia egg.--Nobody777 14:16, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Probably

the only possible explanation is that nintendo wanted to release this as a surprise goodie to stir things up along with the figures, so they cancelled it in all over world but forgot potugal, so its a company mistake, although that thing revealed alot such as creation of darkrai, one can see the two having some slight resemblance only by the shape of the head (somewhat), and thus arceus and darkrai are somewhat of a duo, somewhat, and some what of a trio if a crescelia is considered, and if so this is the first time that a trio master is part of a trio, but i'm still sceptical, didnt anybody else get such a booklet in portugal??? - unsigned comment from Nobody777 (talk • contribs)

Yeah You're right! Why did Darkrai born in Arceus' shadow? Maybe Arceus is too powerful that even his shadow is able do create a Pokémon - unsigned comment from SakasFixe (talk • contribs)

Umm... C*CK PUNCH!

But seriously. Read this. There could be a subpage about Legendary Quads. Just for the Muskeeter group.--444Zekrom 10:30, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Landros, master of the Raijin trio?

Has a higher base stat total, is encountered in a different way (and level), requires both the other members to be captured to be encountered... It is fairly different from the other 2, and it screams trio master for me. We need to get more information, but keep it in mind. Eriorguez 17:24, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Done.--444Zekrom 09:56, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

My thoughts on Keldeo

I think that Keldeo should be the leader of the Musketeer group since it is an event Pokémon and requires the other three to make it learn the Sacred Sword (I think) move. —♫Zekasaur♫ 11:39, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

The problem is, it's not the leader. In fact, it's the opposite: Keldeo is the youngest of the group and was adopted by the other three. --Andy^P_K^M_N 12:25, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

You mean Sword of Mystery, but the Musketeers are definitely different than the other groups. --Ve№moth ♦ 23:15, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I was really confused. —♫Zekasaur♫ 04:51, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Zekasaur. Here is my quote from the Musketeer's page: "If, as we have noted, Keldeo is not truly part of the trio, and it is (semi) far apart from the others in the Pokedex, wouldn't Keldeo be qualified for Trio Master? This would also save us from the trio/musketeers/quartet dilemma." So, how about it? I am Darth Mewtwo... Fear me, and my team made entirely of Mewtwo!!! 18:37, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Kyurem

Seems to me it's probably meant to be the trio master, consider: It's the "Boundary pokemon," probably meaning the one who maintains balance between Reshiram and Zekrom and apparently the game creators made it the one that could use Cold Flare and Freeze Bolt (though apparently not officially), moves containing both types of the other two, they can't. Also it has higher HP. --—Ve№moth ♦ 20:37, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

It's too early to say. We'll have to wait for the third game or more info to come out first Ataro 20:49, 21 December 2010 (UTC)