Talk:Trio master

Don't you think this is overdoing it a bit? -Happy Mask Man 17:24, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

I agree. This reads a bit more like fanfiction/fan terminology than anything. --Zeta 17:50, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Eh, I figured it needed to have a name. After all, there is a definite relationship between the birds and Lugia, the beasts and Ho-oh, and the Regis and Regigigas.

Think it should just be a subpage of Legendary trio? Tom Temprotran 20:35, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Forget a subpage, just merge it into the main trio article as a section. That article is short anyway. --WikidSmaht 09:09, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

So, uh, when's something going to be done about this silly article? -Happy Mask Man 01:17, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Arceus

Isn't Arceus the master of Trio masters?--KukiTalk 16:31, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

All we know is it's the master of the lake trio. Ho-Oh, Lugia, and Regigigas... well, they actually seem to be overlords of sky, sea, and land. TTEchidna 16:45, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

i thought Groudon, Kyogre, and Rayquaza were the overlords of the land, sea, and sky. I kind of pictured Ho-Oh and Lugia as guardians. and i'm not even sure what to think of Regigigas as of yet. InuMimi 12:39, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Remember that while Kyogre expanded the seas, Groudon expanded the continents, and Rayquaza brought neutral ground (and not ground as in Groudon, but you get what I mean) with the sky, they are very much beings of these domains, and have never been shown to watch over the effects of the domains they represent. Rayquaza may keep the balance between Kyogre and Groudon, but it seems to simply be a leader of the Sky World, rather than its Guardian. The Hebrew mythological/legendary/Biblical creatures known as Behemoth, Leviathan, and Ziz are seen as the Great Beasts of the Earth, Sea, and Sky (respectively), but not as the Guardians of these domains. They simply are the Greatest of the inhabitants of these domains. I'm not saying that Pokémon has to adhere to the stories that its Legendaries are based on, but they do provide a hint. Now, granted, Kyogre and Groudon's information in the version they do not appear in is important in that is states that Kyogre brought the relief of rain to those caught in drought, and Groudon brought and end to the monsoon-like rains that tormented various regions. But these are born from aspects of their nature - the ability to expand the seas or earth with Drizzle and Drought respectively. This would seem to state that Kyogre is actually the guardian of the Earth - as it brought balance back to regions suffering drought, the negative aspects of Groudon - and that Groudon is the guardian of the Seas, for precisely the equal and opposite reasons. Of course, they are not the guardians of each others' domains, though they do keep each other in check somewhat, when they're not sleeping, that is. And when they are both awake - well it seemed that they actually didn't want to fight each other in the games at least, and that it was the Orbs that drove them out of control. The citizens of Sootopolis in Emerald state that the two look like they actually don't want to be fighting each other, as if they are being forced to by the Red and Blue Orbs (which may or may not be man-made). And Rayquaza has been seen to keep them in check when this does happen (though somehow Lance and Ash and co. were able to stop them without Rayquaza in the anime). But even Rayquaza has been seen as very defensive of its area - in Movie 7 it attacked Deoxys on sight simply because Deoxys entered it's domain. That's more like an attack dog than a guardian trying to keep the balance of the skies.

Lugia has shown multiple times that if it existed in the sky, it would cause catastrophic events that could effect the entire world, but by maintaining its powers beneath the sea it is able to keep the balance of the world's water, and therefore the source of life (as seen in a traditional Buddhist sense, as well as in, say, Movies 1, 2, 4, 5, and 9). Ho-oh has been seen as the maker of Rainbows and the being that ends the storms that could cause pain and suffering to the world, so it is the guardian of the Sky World. Ironically, the Legendary Birds and their actions affect the sea and are governed by Lugia, while the Legendary beasts are governed by Ho-oh.

The Regi trio seem to have been made by Man, the class of beings often associated with the Earth, as bone and muscle and flesh are very Earthy substances. But Regigigas has been known as the being that pulled the Continents together by towing them with ropes, and it is also seen in Movie 11 as providing its phenomenal strength and its mastery over the great beasts that walk the Earth (here being Mammoswine) to prevent catastrophes such as that of the Glacidia glacier moving and causing much devastation across the Earth. Regigigas is perhaps the most Deus ex Machina a Pokémon movie character could get (though Kyogre in Movie 9 comes close), as he basically solves the final crisis of the movie, when Ash and co. couldn't. Regigigas' role of herding Megafauna is very Earth-based as well - see the Ground egg group, and it's role with Mammals (or HSOWA). Mammals almost define Earth and its denizens, though they certainly are not the only ones; but their association with humans and agriculture and also with the ancient Megafauna that dominated this world in the early Cenozoic are definitely indications that Regigigas is like a human of the ancient world, and how humans see themselves as the Stewards of Earth (or at least should...).

So my point here is that while Groudon, Kyogre, and Rayquaza represent the elemental energies that empower the three domains of Earth, Sea, and Sky, respectively, it is Regigigas, Lugia, and Ho-oh (again respectively) that are the stewards of these domains. Groudon, Kyogre, and Rayquaza represent a trio (though a statistically imbalanced trio as Rayquaza is stronger than the other two), but one without a Trio Master because they keep each other in-balance ability-wise (and if Kyogre has some possible connection with "the Beast of the Sea", than it may be that the Trio Masters each keep the Weather Trio member in their domain balanced as well, though that's getting more into speculation). Regigigas, Lugia, and Ho-oh are Trio Masters because of their Pokédex and series lore about their roles, which connect them with both the Trios they control and their domains of Land, Sea, and Sky. The association with Lugia and the Moon and Ho-oh and the Sun - that's another story that has absolutely no basis save the opening screens of Silver and Gold versions.

Arceus has yet to have been shown as the Master of Trio Masters, as has he yet to have been shown as the Master of the Dragon Trio (though this will probably be revealed next summer with Movie 12). So until then, Arceus remains as the Trio Master of the Lake Trio, only. But having created the entire world and its planes, I would assume he could be considered the master of the Weather Trio, the Dragon Trio, as well as relegating the Beast Trio, Bird Trio, and Regi Trio to Ho-oh, Lugia, and Regigigas. That, however, is speculation for now. Thank you for your time. Satosuke 03:53, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Arceus

Isn't he the trio master of the dragons as well.We know for sure he created Dialga and Palkia (and he probably created Giratina to start the reverse world but that is just speculation) which is like how Ho-oh created the Beasts and Ho-oh is the beast master so Arceus should be noted as the Dragon Trio Master or as Master of Dialga and Palkia. Sailor Earth 16:22, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

True, but if he's only the master of Dialga and Palkia, then he's not a Trio Master, just a Duo Master, so to speak.

Please add your sig with the four tildes after you comment. Arceus is almost certainly the Trio Master of the Dragon Trio as well; however, his relationship with Giratina is still not yet confirmed, while it's been established that he either created Dialga and Palkia or else they are warring aspects of himself (sorry for using the masculine noun-forms). Until Movie 12 comes out, we probably won't have an answer to that, so for now, Arceus remains only as the Trio Master of the Lake Trio. Satosuke 03:56, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

lake trio master

in the Pokémon Pearl PokéDex data itt says the followinng : It is thought that Uxie,Mesprit and Azelf all came from the same egg. Is it the egg that Arceus came from or another legendary Pokémon ?--Nobody777 12:58, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Who knows, It might've been an egg fromm mew? --Force Fire 13:08, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Ah Ah Ah Ah...

What about deleting this article? Come on, this is just random observation with fanwanked explanation. We don't need article about this! --Maxim 17:08, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

A little late, but this should merged into the legendary trio article. Anyone oppose? MK 03:12, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Naw, it's a good article. It could be fleshed out a bit more, and after Movie 12, it will probably be bigger with the Dragon Trio added. I say keep it for now. Satosuke 03:58, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

I agree with Maxim here. The article is inconsistent and attempts to reveal patterns that don’t exist. Lugia definitely isn’t the master of the birds in the games, for example, and Ho‐oh is not the master of the beasts in the anime (AFAIK; bear in mind that I haven’t watched the show in years). The fact that we repeat Rayquaza really shows that this is just shoehorning. Legendary trios this is not. IIMarckus 22:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Lake Trio Giratina

I'm starting to think that the lake trio is led by Giratina. After all, they did kinda summon him and lead the player to him and he appears in the fourth lake of Sinnoh. This is purely speculation but so are the others, except the Golems.Shadow1337 23:57, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Yeah good points, I think you could be right yknow. --Guardian of Earth |SGMS 2010 20:58, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Possibly, however, it clearly states that Arceus created the Lake Trio himself. Satosuke 21:18, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

Isn't Arceus the master of two trios?

I'm pretty sure he's the master of the Dragon trio too. Master Lucario

As Unown Lord said, "It is one thing to claim that Dialga, Palkia and Giratina constitute a trio, but going as far as suggesting that Arceus created Giratina is simply unfounded and will be avoided until proven in-game."--Kkllnn blastoise 22:34, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

As I've said numerous times throughout this talk page, we'll get our answer most likely in Movie 12. Wait until then. Satosuke 04:47, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

In Platinum, it said that Giratina was the member that "no one talked about." You can't create two members of a trio without creating the third, especially when the third is basically a parallel universe! TorchicBlaziken ^{(talk•edits)} 13:18, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

No proof for Giratina...?

...I recall in Pokemon Platinum, at the Spear Pillar, Cynthia states that Giratina was created alongside Dialga and Palkia, though never talked about...- unsigned comment from M190049 (talk • contribs)

It isn't a trio master.--RexRacer -talk 21:25, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

...I didn't say it is. In the text, it says "According to legend, Arceus created Dialga and Palkia. Whether Arceus created Giratina or not is unknown."

...It kind of confirms this in Platinum.

~m190049^~talk 21:47, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

With the facts, it seems Arceus DID in fact create Giratina. It does kinda confirm it in Pt...--DRAGONBEAST^X 21:50, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Okay than. I'll remove the sentence. ~m190049^~talk 21:55, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

M'kay, I removed it and replaced it with a new one. ~m190049^~talk 22:08, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

I think that this chart would be better

I'm just not sure wether or not you'll agree.

Trio	Master	Relation
a:File:Legendary_birds.jpg Legendary Birds	Lugia	Lugia rises to quell the fighting of the legendary birds in The Power of One, and is the only one who is able to do so.
Legendary beasts	Ho-Oh	After the three legendary beasts perished in the fire at the Brass Tower, Ho-Oh revived them.
a:File:GenIII_Battle.jpg Weather Trio	Rayquaza	Rayquaza may internally be the master of the weather trio, primarily because it had quelled the fighting between the other members of its trio in Pokémon Emerald.
Legendary Golems	Regigigas	Regigigas will awaken on bringing the three legendary golems to Snowpoint Temple. Regigigas' Pokémon Platinum Pokédex entry also claims that it built statues made of rocks, ice, and magma.
Dragon Trio	Arceus	According to legend, Arceus created Dialga and Palkia, and it's stated in Pokémon Platinum that Giratina was created alongside them, thus completing the dragon trio. All four legendary Pokémon will battle in the 12th Movie, Arceus: To a Conquering Spacetime.
a:File:MespritAzelfUxie.jpg Lake Trio		Arceus is also said to have created the lake trio whilst creating the universe, making Arceus the only trio master that is related to two legendary trios rather than just one.

This chart is smaller and less image heavy, and it's a little more convenient if your looking for the master of a certain trio. Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 20:27, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

The fact that the images clash with each other turns me off on the idea. -Sketch 20:57, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

What do you mean by clash together? Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 13:35, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

They don't look good together. Also, it is hard to see which trio is which; they all just look like blurs of color at that resolution. With that said, the point of an article is to read it and not just look at the pictures, so how about we do just that. If one reads the column title it shouldn't be a problem. Not to mention the master is the first in the row, and therefore the one the eye should first travel to. — THE TROM — 21:19, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

They look fine to me. I can see the images just fine.And do you realy think that every pokémon in every trio should be shown? Isn't this article about the masters? Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 23:52, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Uh...yeah? That's what that column is for. The images are all of varying quality too. The Bird Trio and Lake Trio are screenshots and the others are official art. The The Regi art is the worst of them all: anime image on a white background. If we use this, just the their menu sprites in there.

Trio	Master	Relation
Legendary Birds	Lugia	Lugia rises to quell the fighting of the legendary birds in The Power of One, and is the only one who is able to do so.

And if you do this, make sure all three sprites are on the same row...not like how I have it there with Moltres on it's own line. -Sketch 11:10, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

You know, Sketch, you might have an idea there. The Master is larger than the pokémon in the trio, which makes it the first thing you see, and the trio pokémon are small and almost unnoticeable. One thing's for sure, it's better than mine. Dolphins_are_awesome (and Vulpix are too)! 21:02, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

What.

A quote from the Trivia: "Lugia is the only trio master who did not debut in the same generation as its trio."

What about Regigigas? It's from Gen. IV and its trio is Gen. III. Reign 01:23, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Has been removed. You know, you are allowed to take out this stuff yourself. —darklordtrom 21:38, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Ehh...Every edit I make someone reverts and tells me not to do it again, I decided to take the safer route here. Reign 09:10, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Arceus the double master

Isn't Arceus really the master of all the trios? CuboneKing 17:00, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Well, Arceus is the master of two trios but he can boss all the other masters about. Lunick v sonela 17:07, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Lugia

Was Lugia's relation to the other three birds ever mentioned in any of the games? Or is it just anime exclusive? I don't remember there being any mention of it in the original GSC games, but is there anything about it in the remakes? Morgil27 17:59, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

It's in Mystery Dungeon R/B. —darklordtrom 20:55, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Ah, i see. I haven't played any of those Mystery Dungeon games. But aren't they in an entirely different world then the main games and anime, though? Morgil27 21:08, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Real History

I'm from Portugal and when they distributed Arceus for Diamond, Pearl and Platinum versions they gave me a booklet telling the history. I quote:

Arceus is regarded as the Pokémon God, the creator of the Pokémon universe.

This is a legendary Pokémon, Alpha species and normal type. Though, if it have some elemental plates it can be transformed in one of 17 types of Pokémon. This is its powerful multi-type ability.

The story goes that Arceus was born from an egg in chaos even before the outbreak of the cosmos.

Arceus began creating Pokémon to put everything in place. The first thing he did was to create Mew to take account of the universe, this one and Arceus are the Pokémon that accompanied the formation process of the cosmos.

Then he had to create Shaymin so that nature arise and to maintain balance. Arceus created Dialga, which in turn gave rise to time, and Palkia, which led to the space. Giratina created to control the death and, if necessary, act as mediator between Dialga and Palkia.

After that, it created Jirachi that put the stars on firmament. Once created light, thanks to Jirachi, immediatly Darkrai could be seen in Arceus' shadow. Arceus thought to give a mystic touch to the universe and created Cresselia, the first Pokémon with feelings. This created the moon and, thanks to the feelings, wanted some help and company, so it created the legendary trio formed by Uxie, Mesprit and Azelf and later the Clefairy. This legendary trio was later charged with providing living beings with feelings, like emotion, knowledge and will, basic features that represent each. Welcome to the Pokémon Universe.

That means Arceus created Mew, Shaymin, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, Jirachi and Cresselia. Cresselia created Clefairy, Uxie, Mesprit and Azelf. Darkrai was created by Arceus' shadow.

For people who knows portuguese:

Arceus é considerado como o Pokémon Deus, criador do universo Pokémon.

Trata-se de um Pokémon lendário, da especie Alpha e de tipo Normal. No entanto, se possuir algumas das elemental plates pode transformar-se num dos 17 tipos de Pokémon. esta é a sua poderosa capacidade multi-tipo.

Reza a história de que Arceus nasceu de um ovo imerso no caos ainda antes de eclodir o cosmos.

Arceus começou a criar Pokémon para colocar tudo no seu lugar. A primeira coisa que fez foi criar Mew para que tomassse conta do universo, pelo que este último e Arceus são os Pokémon que acompanharam o processo de formação do cosmos.

Depois teve de criar Shaymin para que a natureza surgisse e para manter o equilibrio. Arceus criou Dialga, que por sua vez deu origem ao tempo, e Palkia, que deu origem ao espaço. Criou Giratina para que controlasse a morte e, se necessário, agisse como mediador entre Dialga e Palkia.

Posteriormente criou Jirachi que colocou as estrelas no firmamento. Uma vez criada a luz, graças a Jirachi, imediatamente foi possível ver Darkrai na sombra de Arceus. Arceus pensou dar ao universo um toque místico pelo que criou Cresselia, o primeiro Pokémon com sentimentos. Este criou a lua e, graças aos seu sentimentos, desejou ter ajuda e companhia, pelo que criou o trio lendário formado por Uxie, Mesprit e Azelf e posteriormente os Clefairy, este trio lendário ficou encarregue de mais tarde dotar os seres vivos de sentimentos, como a emoção, a sabedoria e a vontade, cracterísticas básicas que representam cada um dele. Bem-vindo ao universo Pokémon. - unsigned comment from SakasFixe (talk • contribs)

Sounds like fanfiction.

Please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). 梅子^❀_✿ 20:08, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Well, it's not fanfiction because it's real. When I read it for the first time I was confused too, but... it also says how to receive Arceus and it's caracteristics:

Pokédex nr. 493 Specie: Alpha Type: Normal Ability: Multi-Type High: 3,2 m Weight: 320,0 kg Level: 100 Experience points: 1.250.000 Object: Baya Magua (Magua Berry) - unsigned comment from SakasFixe (talk • contribs)

Could you possibly show us a scan or pics of this pamphlet?

Please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). 梅子^❀_✿ 20:44, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm calling unofficial until GameFreak of Japan says something like this. "Giratina was created to control death"? If I'm nto mistaken it was confirmed to be antimatter some time ago. Reign 20:48, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

How can I Ulpoad pictures to Bulbapedia?

I knew about the control of antimatter but, I'm good in Particule Phisics, if Giratina controls Antimatter it must be made of antimatter and he couldn't come to our world or we to its.

--Sakas 18:26, 13 April 2010 (UTC)SakasFixe

Ok forget it.

---

a:File:First Part.jpg

---

a:File:Second Part.jpg

---

a:File:Third Part.jpg

I don't think you understand the nature of our request to see scans/pics. We want to see the part that proves that it is officially endorsed by Nintendo.

Please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). 梅子^❀_✿ 02:04, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Ok! These pics were taken with my DSi and, I don't know why, only three pics are jpeg, others are the symbol of Nintendo, Cover of the booklet and back cover. Thoses pics was, like the others, transfered for facebook and the format is png

I will try to convert them

Sakas 19:49, 14 April 2010 (UTC)SakasFixe

Ok I get it

---

a:File:Back cover.JPG

---

a:File:Cover.JPG

---

a:File:Cover 2.JPG

I'm still doubtful of it. It's stated in the games that the lake guardians were made by Arceus, along with Dialga and Palkia (and Giratina, too, as Cynthia reveals). Nintendo knows their legends. TTEchidna 01:52, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

So why did they created that story? It is real! Trust me! I know it seems weird but that's what is written there. I understand your position. You can ask Nintendo. And... where is stated in the games that they are a creation of Arceus? Sakas 17:43, 25 May 2010 (UTC)SakasFixe

well that means that Crescelia is a the trio master of the pixie trio, denouncing Arceus as their trio masters, that also means that the trio hatched from the same crescelia egg.--Nobody777 14:16, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Probably

the only possible explanation is that nintendo wanted to release this as a surprise goodie to stir things up along with the figures, so they cancelled it in all over world but forgot potugal, so its a company mistake, although that thing revealed alot such as creation of darkrai, one can see the two having some slight resemblance only by the shape of the head (somewhat), and thus arceus and darkrai are somewhat of a duo, somewhat, and some what of a trio if a crescelia is considered, and if so this is the first time that a trio master is part of a trio, but i'm still sceptical, didnt anybody else get such a booklet in portugal??? - unsigned comment from Nobody777 (talk • contribs)

Yeah You're right! Why did Darkrai born in Arceus' shadow? Maybe Arceus is too powerful that even his shadow is able do create a Pokémon - unsigned comment from SakasFixe (talk • contribs)

Umm... C*CK PUNCH!

But seriously. Read this. There could be a subpage about Legendary Quads. Just for the Muskeeter group.--444Zekrom 10:30, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Landros, master of the Raijin trio?

Has a higher base stat total, is encountered in a different way (and level), requires both the other members to be captured to be encountered... It is fairly different from the other 2, and it screams trio master for me. We need to get more information, but keep it in mind. Eriorguez 17:24, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Done.--444Zekrom 09:56, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

My thoughts on Keldeo

I think that Keldeo should be the leader of the Musketeer group since it is an event Pokémon and requires the other three to make it learn the Sacred Sword (I think) move. —♫Zekasaur♫ 11:39, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

The problem is, it's not the leader. In fact, it's the opposite: Keldeo is the youngest of the group and was adopted by the other three. --Andy^P_K^M_N 12:25, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

You mean Sword of Mystery, but the Musketeers are definitely different than the other groups. --Ve№moth ♦ 23:15, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I was really confused. —♫Zekasaur♫ 04:51, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Zekasaur. Here is my quote from the Musketeer's page: "If, as we have noted, Keldeo is not truly part of the trio, and it is (semi) far apart from the others in the Pokedex, wouldn't Keldeo be qualified for Trio Master? This would also save us from the trio/musketeers/quartet dilemma." So, how about it? I am Darth Mewtwo... Fear me, and my team made entirely of Mewtwo!!! 18:37, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Kyurem

Seems to me it's probably meant to be the trio master, consider: It's the "Boundary pokemon," probably meaning the one who maintains balance between Reshiram and Zekrom and apparently the game creators made it the one that could use Cold Flare and Freeze Bolt (though apparently not officially), moves containing both types of the other two, they can't. Also it has higher HP. --—Ve№moth ♦ 20:37, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

It's too early to say. We'll have to wait for the third game or more info to come out first Ataro 20:49, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

May I point out that Kyurem's base stat total is lesser than that of zekrom and reshiram, so there might be a new one to fill that void as it would be hard for it to control those other two. Just a thought, mind you. We'll all find out eventually. Luxraychu 00:02, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

Whenever I join in a conversation, it dies. Awww... Luxraychu 03:29, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Lake Trio

Is it possible Cresselia is the master of the Lake Trio? As stated above, in the Real History section, Cresselia did (possibly) create the trio, and as quoted from Cresselia's page, "Cresselia's three main colors (pink, yellow and blue) are the same as the main colors of the Lake guardians." It seems they also used the same shades of the above colors. In addition, they are all Psychic type. I am Darth Mewtwo... Fear me, and my team made entirely of Mewtwo!!! 22:12, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Hello? I would like an answer. I am Darth Mewtwo... Fear me, and my team made entirely of Mewtwo!!! 04:18, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Even if it is, there is not enough evidence that Cresselia is the Lake Trio's master. :/ --Han Ji-Wan 04:26, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Legendary Golems

Should it say some where that Regirock, Regice, Registeel, and Regigigas are all weak to fighting? Or does it already say that somewhere? (Plokool 02:18, 27 October 2011 (UTC))

Kyurem vs Cobalion

Since this new movie is featuring Kyurem and the musketeer Pokemon, is it possible that Kyurem is their master? Or is it to early to tell? Once we see the movie, if it turns out my theory is right, I think it's worth adding, but I suppose time will tell. Frenchhorn 03:57, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Besides the movie, what does Kyurem have in common with the musketeers? The types don't coincide (Flying for the Legendary birds), there is no historical connection (Ho-Oh bringing back the Legendary beasts after their death, Landorus stopping Thundurus and Tornadus, Arceus creating the creation trio and the lake guardian trio), there is no name similarity to make them slot straight in (Regi- Rock, Steel, Ice, Gigas), and there is no ability connection (Rayquaza's Air Lock to neutralise Kyogre and Groudon). There is no point speculating until Kyurem and Keldeo are given a proper spotlight in an upcoming game. Toon Ganondorf (t c) 22:27, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

duo+master=/=trio

Doesn't "trio" imply three equal parts? For example I find it silly that it's the "weather trio" when 2 of them cause weather, and the stronger one neutralizes it (not to mention the dozen other ways Rayquaza is superior to them, including a more intelligent guardian-like role, instead of wreaking havoc). A weather-duo with an anti-weather-guardian would be the right direction. Same for the cloud demons. And the musketeers; if anything Cobalion is at least part of the trio, Keldeo the adoptee is the one whos place in it is in the air for now. But even then, Cobalion being their master, based on its vague role in the family, with nothing else that would make it stick out in any way (unlike Keldeo) is too much. They don't have a master, just a student. Also the word master feels so misleading (it's not like they own or control each other), but.. there is no fitting word for meaningless obvious connections between legendaries that I know of.

I also want to note that the pokemon fanbase is exaggerating the creation myths/legends part of legendary pokemon when it comes to this kind of speculation (which may be what GF were aiming for though XD). The only things that really presents these creatures as supernatural beings with godlike powers, are their myths. The facts are simply that pokemon exist, who are stronger than usual and have some neat abilities (affecting the weather, manipulating dimensions a bit). They don't even show any sign of near human-like intelligence, actually they can happen to get caught into pokeballs by strong trainers and battle for them like usual (unless one considered anime canon, but its kind of hard to take serious when they disregard lots of things from the games and make up just as much own crap as they go along). Think of it that way; in the old times, some people witnessed a legendary like Groudon or Arceus, saw water evaporating wherever it went/saw it call a bunch of Unowns to make an egg or two fall out of the sky, and as they passed the info on, it turned into myth starring Groudon as the landmass god or Arceus as the creator of the universe. Same for the rest. They didn't create anything, they're just very rare/gone/hidden and best at manipulating specific things. Thanks for anyone who actually reads this, just had to vent it somewhere already Dx --Saiph charon 15:14, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

In regards to your opening sentence, the word "trio" just means "group of three", and in no way implies equality within the group. Werdnae (talk) 04:02, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Well alright, but what makes the difference between the Regis being a trio with master instead of being a quartet, if not that the three share more similarities between each other than with Regigigas? If the Regis aren't a quartet then Groudon and Kyogre are a duo with a master/guardian (as they have so many similarities while Rayquaza sticks out as superior on multiple levels, even design-wise), same for the Kami. Also at the moment we have no idea what will become of Kyurem and how it really relates to the other 2, but in the current state they're not a trio by that logic (even if Kyurem gets buffed up, itd be a Rayquaza situation in the end).--Saiph charon 11:03, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Rayquaza doesn't really stick out from Groudon and Kyogre to me. They all have something to do with weather (neutralizing weather still involves weather), have similar markings, their movesets are even slightly similar. I can see how the Regis and Regigigas could be a quartet, except that Regigigas came out in a different generation. I feel like that sets it farther apart from the other Regis than Rayquaza is from Groudon and Kyogre. Plus, I find that the reference to Regigigas creating the Regi trio also sets it apart. If it created them, shouldn't it be their master and not part of their group? Like Ho-oh and the Legendary Beasts. These are just my opinions, though. Crystal Talian 11:15, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

It could have caused Sandstorm or Hail but instead it neutralizes weather, that is clearly superior. It doesnt wreak havoc, it steps in to calm the idiots down. It has 3 different colors of markings (red, black AND yellow) instead of just 1 (red or black). It has 2 types instead of 1. It has superior stats.... either everything ends up being part of a single octagesimaltet or its grouped by sharing the same amount of similarities. lol.--Saiph charon 15:26, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Kyurem

Well B2W2 have been out for a while and I think it's safe to say Kyurem is the Tao Trio master.Micamike45 (talk) 04:31, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Do you have any reason why it would be the master? Ataro (talk) 06:46, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Well, Kyurem seems to be the corpse of the original dragon. Kyurem can be combined with Zekrom to form Black Kyurem or with Reshiram to form White Kyurem with the DNA Splicers, which makes Kyrem seem dominant over the other two. It represents a boundary of some sort. It also wants to reunite with Zekrom and Reshiram. Micamike45 (talk) 19:08, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

I disagree, it didn't display that it could have "dominated" them on its own. It was only with Team Plasma's intervention that it was able to, as otherwise it would not have had the DNA Splicers necessary for that to occur, nor the power to track down Reshiram/Zekrom. Black Kyurem and White Kyurem are more "proof" of Ghetsis (and later the player character) ruling over Reshiram/Zekrom than Kyurem doing so. Personally, I've never really liked the concept of "trio masters". People seem too eager to force things into these roles when they may or may not be fitting. But this is getting off-topic from my original comment. >.> Sorry for the rambling. RiverShock (talk) 02:23, 25 November 2012 (UTC)

The DNA Splicers are originally owned by Drayden not made by Team Plasma, so Black/White Kyurem could have been formed without Team Plasma's existence. I don't remember exactly how Drayden said he aquired them but I think he said they are passed down by his family which leaves their origin in question.Micamike45 (talk) 23:33, 25 November 2012 (UTC)

You missed the point. If Team Plasma hadn't stolen them, Kyurem would have never fused with Reshiram or Zekrom, or even been able to. Drayden had no reason or desire to use them, and I'm not even sure he knew what their use was. RiverShock (talk) 15:50, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

I realize that, I'm just saying it's possible Kyurem could have fused with Reshiram/Zekrom in the past without Plasma's intervention since the DNA Splicers existed before Team Plasma. I will adimit though, that the DNA Splicers are probably human-made and not created by Kyurem or anything.Micamike45 (talk) 02:22, 27 November 2012 (UTC)

Meloetta the Kami Trio's Master

We've placed Landorus as the Kami Trio's in house Trio master...but wouldn't Meloetta also fit the bill since it controlled their transformation in the anime, and got them back under control after they went berserk.

I know its just in the anime, but we consider Lugia the bird trio's master and that was in a movie.

Evidence: Meloetta, like the Kami trio, also has a form change.

Meloetta is needed, at least in the anime, to help the Trio achieve their Therian Forme.

When all three went berserk, it was Meloetta who calmed them, and then changed them back to their Incarnate forme.

The evidence of Meloetta being the true Trio master is piling up. Yamitora1 (talk) 22:25, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

But the game doesn't have enough evidence to support that. Plus, they dont share similarities in origin. However, If you look at the base stats, Meloetta does have a base stat equivalent to landorus. However, I dont think there are very concrete evidence that support this. --Nobody777 (talk) 03:45, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

We're not going by the games here; if we were going by the games then Lugia would be completely ousted as the Trio master for the legendary birds since the games have no evidence for it. Lugia's title was granted because of the movie a power of one, just as Meloetta's title should be granted Yamitora1 (talk) 21:01, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

I really think this should be discussed. Meloetta, albeit in the anime only, is definitely fitting for the role. Also as I've mentioned, Lugia got its title from a movie which isn't much different than the anime. Meloetta is needed to call upon the trio to the ruins, transform them into their Therian forms, control them, calm them and turn them back to their Incarnate forms. It also (as pointed out by Nobody777) has the same stat total with other similarities such as gaining atk in their alternate forms. Yamitora1 (talk) 10:12, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

This will not be discused, because Trio Masters are dictated by the games' canon. Since it's established in the games that Landorus is the Trio Master, there is no discussion in that regard. In the case of Lugia, there's no mention wether if it is or not, hence, another continuity's canon had to be adopted, since its role in the movie was fitting that of a Master. If the games said otherwise, it would be removed of this list. hfc2X 09:55, 20 May 2013 (UTC)

Suggested merge

This is a fan term for a phenomenon that's only loosely present in the games, and no explicit connection/comparison between trio masters has (to my knowledge) ever been made in canon, suggesting to me that there is not a pressing need for them to be grouped together in the mainspace. Furthermore, virtually every instance of the subject matter itself is pretty debatable:

• Lugia is a trio master only in the anime
• Ho-Oh is a trio master only in the games
• Rayquaza and Landorus (and Kyurem, if you subscribe to that theory, which is mentioned in Trivia but not in the main body of the page) are already members of their trios, making them not quite fit the pattern
• Regigigas and Arceus are said to have created the trios they're supposedly "trio master" of, but there's otherwise no indication they actually have any sway over them the way other trio masters are supposed to
• The Swords of Justice are properly a quartet, not a trio, and if we're going to single any of them out, it should really be Keldeo since it's the one that canon actually does single out as different from the others (but more importantly, the Swords canonically don't fit the trio-and-master dynamic to begin with, so they shouldn't be here at all even if the page continues to exist)

So yeah, basically, I don't believe there's any actual canonical justification for this to be a mainspace page. I think we should do what we did with Electric rodents: pare it down to the essentials and use that to expand its section on Appendix:Fan terminology. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 20:02, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Months ago I brought up the issue for Landorus being given the title despite in the anime Meloetta having actual sway over how they take their other forms and the only response was a juvenile argument backed by no real evidence, and the Lugia evidence manipulated to fit their POV.

I'm actually more in favor of abolishing this entire article, since it serves no real purpose and is nothing but speculation brought forth through fan head cannon and happenstance evidence weaker than an ounce of instant coffee in a water cooler. Yamitora1 (talk) 20:58, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

I agree that this article/concept is too much of fanon. However, like "electric rodents", the concept of a "trio master" is popular enough in fanon that we'll have to document it somehow, but I don't think this quite warrants its own page either. I personally support a merge to the Appendix:Fan terminology, this is the kind of thing that article is for. Popular fanon should be documented, but not treated like it's an official thing. --ZestyCactus 22:05, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Well, since its a page specifically for fandom stuff, I think it should be placed there. But the style of the article seems sterile, so what info would really be added that isn't already on the article to begin with?Yamitora1 (talk) 23:29, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Other 'references'

I'm a little unsure about some of the things that appear in the other references to trio masters section. To me, some of them really don't seem like references at all, namely having to purify all of the Shadow Pokémon in Colosseum and having to befriend all 300 Pokémon in the Oblivia Browser in Guardian signs in order to encounter Ho-oh and Lugia, respectively. Yes, in each of these cases the befriending of a legendary trio is required to meet their master, but befriending the trio specifically is not. The three legendary birds are indeed needed to encounter Lugia in Guardian Signs, but so are 297 other Pokémon. That doesn't seem like much of a reference to me. It's not even like they're the only legendary trio that appear in the Oblivia Browser anyway. This also applies to the legendary golems in Shadows of Almia. I think that these three points should be removed from the page. Dannyboy601 (talk) 16:34, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

Why does this exist?

Why has this fanfiction page returned to dominance? It makes no sense to have this on every legendary page and only even begins to make sense by combining sources from difference canon. Lugia is not a "trio master" in the games and it's not a term that's ever even uttered in the anime or manga, any details that this page tells us can be told on the appropriate section of each Pokemons page (such as Lugias relation to the legendary birds in the anime). This is an eyesore on an otherwise factual and accurate wiki and needs to be mass deleted.Five (talk) 09:14, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

I fully agree, but as far as I'm aware this has been brought up before and never gained much traction. We would need to get the approval of the Editorial Board to delete it, so the most effective path forward might be to make your pitch on one of their talk pages in hopes of convincing them to discuss it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 16:14, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

I disagree, this page is useful in describing a recurring relationship between legendary Pokémon in the games. While I agree that Lugia's inclusion is perhaps questionable, the others are clearly trio masters. Ho-oh resurrected the dogs, regigagas is clearly the master of the regis, arceus created the creation and lake trio, Rayquaza and Landorus are clearly internal leaders. It's clear that whenever there's a trio, there's usually a clear external or internal leader/master/overseer (whatever you want to call them). I say that's noteworthy JMVB - I don't what to put here. (talk) 18:52, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

It's not canonical, though. It's all fan inferences. It belongs, at best, on Appendix:Fan terminology, not in the mainspace. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 05:40, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

Perhaps it isn't canon. However, the issue for deletion is apparently "it is fanon and therefore does not belong in the mainspace." And if that is the reason, then we had better be prepared to do quite a bit of deleting for a reason that seems to be worded oddly. --Super goku (talk) 06:00, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

Fanon =/= fandom. The vast majority of those pages are documenting the Pokémon fandom in real life and/or on the Internet. This page (and a small handful of pages on that list, like HM slave) is instead trying to describe something in the games that is entirely inferred or invented by fans. The latter category of pages, in my opinion, do not belong on a self-respecting encyclopedia like we hope to be. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 06:08, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

Wiki's should always be factual, preferably with supporting evidence. My problem is that many articles on here now, this trio master stuff specifically, relies far too heavily on assumptions, theories and fan ideas, most of which only make sense if you assume anime rules and lore apply to the games, which is something we can say for 100% certainty is not the case. I can understand the argument that fanon has its place here, but it shouldn't be so prominent in the description for every single legendary. It's misleading, if not completely incorrect.Five (talk) 09:32, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

I agree that the page should be deleted. "Trio master" is not a defined, solid concept, and the relationships referred to on the page could easily be moved into a Relationships between Legendary Pokémon section of the Legendary Pokémon article. --Lmoamemesxd (talk) 10:07, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

I'm really not sure you can call this "fanon". In fact, "fandom" really is more accurate. The only thing that's really not canon is the name "trio master", but that's what the unknown name template is for (and look just how many times it's used on this site). Each "master's" status over the respective trio are supported by canon. This relation between one more powerful Pokémon and a trio (or two others, thus creating a trio) isn't exactly disputable. It's mentioned time and time again, in game after game. I don't even give a Schif (Talk • Contribs) 22:04, 26 July 2016 (UTC)

This page should be deleted , but all links to this page should be removed beforehand to remove all traces of this article. And to make there be no red links. Boorider7 (talk) 16:06, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

Except the thing here that is truly non-canon is the term itself. Trio Masters are canon that has been made clear on different occasions such as with the weather trio. And even if the term is non-canon right now there is a good chance it can fall into official usage like Eeveelutions and Shiny Pokémon did. - unsigned comment from Flain (talk • contribs)

As far as I'm concerned, if we have endless pages on shipping, the whole fanon excuse to delete this page is bogus. Move it to an Appendix page, but not deletion. Trio Master relationships are canon in both the games and anime. --HoennMaster 05:38, 28 September 2016 (UTC)

This article should not be deleted, but the rules should be voted on as to what should be taken into consideration as to what qualifies a Pokémon to have such a title. Because it seems only a small group of people have decided what dictates the rules for a trio master, adopting and changing them as they see fit so as to keep the article to their liking. and because of this people with valid points are left without a voice and/or ignored altogether.

Alternatively we could rename the article since master isn't exactly the best description. maybe Trio Mediator would be a better name since Pokémon like Lugia and Rayquaza don't necessarily control as much as counterbalances the others. Yamitora1 (talk) 13:22, 3 February 2017 (UTC)

It should stay because it's describes a phenomenon that appear in pokemon games and media. Anime-only ones like Meloetta and Jigglypuff too must be included in a seperate part of this article.--Martianmister (talk) 13:03, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Rather than deleting this page, here's my take...

I think this page is necessary, and it already makes it clear that "trio master" is a fan term and not particularly elucidated by the games in every instance. While it can be argued Lugia, Ho-Oh, and Arceus being "trio masters" is fanon due to the fact that they only have very loose, very roundabout in-game associations with their respective trios, it is an established fact that Rayquaza is the master of the weather trio, Regigigas is the master of the titans, and Landorus is the master of the Forces of Nature. Each one of those either keeps the other members of its trio in check or created the members of its trio. Lugia on the other hand was only referenced in the game canon as tied to the legendary birds via Sea Spirit's Den, and otherwise, very much unrelated. Ho-Oh has absolutely nothing to do with the legendary beasts other than reviving them. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the three don't worship it, the three don't follow its commands, nor does anyone make a clear connection between the four. Arceus was the creator of the lake guardians and creation trio, but does that necessarily mean it itself is part of those trios? Like the prior examples, it is otherwise a standalone Pokemon with no common design/type/name themes. I think this page simply needs to be reworked rather than deleting it or considering it in its entirety as fanon. Crunchdog29 (talk) 04:52, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

The page should stay...

I think that the page should stay, but it's only a personal opinion. The page might be mostly fanon, but it still contains a lot of canon information, such as how Arceus created the creation trio. --AngelicEspeon (talk) 20:18, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Are legendary pokemon mythos not goofy speculations?

From the beginning, Legendaries were for fun and challenge. The birds were hard to find, hard to catch. Should these beings not have higher authorities within their worlds? The idea of Mythical Pokémon being seperate from legendaries is mostly fan-founded as well! This page has a place, if only under meta or fandom. AmbipomContestant (talk) 03:36, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

Okay what was the point you were trying to make?Flain (talk) 16:42, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

Please delete this article!

It is too fan-speculatey to exist!- unsigned comment from Gmaxwell (talk • contribs)

Removing the Legendary Golems

Since Regieleki and Regidrago have been announced, should the Legendary Golems be removed from this page? Regigigas is now a quintet master instead of a trio master. Ratboy Jr. (talk) 01:27, 4 June 2020 (UTC)

At this point, I think we need to wait for more background for them to determine whether we should just remove it from every trio related page. --Spriteit (talk) 05:15, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

Just remove Regieleki and Regidrago from the Golems section and leave the Hoenn regis if you want them to be a trio. SeanWheeler (talk) 02:41, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

How would "more background" change anything? Regieleki and Regidrago are official Regis, making them canonically not a trio. I say they no longer belong in this page. Golden Trainer (talk) 10:04, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

I feel like we should give Regigigas its own section on this page since it did serve as a Trio Master for four generations. We also don't know what it's relation with Regieleki and Regidrago is going to be yet. --HoennMaster 17:02, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Until The Crown Tundra comes and revel more information on the two new Legendary Titans, maybe leave it the way it is till then. the Second DLC when it comes out can settle this debate, once and for all.--Jacob9594 (talk) 17:39, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

We can't leave it the way it is right now because it's wrong. The new Regis were already added to Regigigas' group in this article, making it a legendary quintet and thus unfitting for this page. I'd say our options are the following:

a) We remove the new Regis for now and deal with it once the DLC comes out

b) We remove the whole group for now. If the DLC comes out and it gives us reason to reinstate them (Yeah right! Does anyone honestly believe that will happen?), we can re-add them later.

c) Or we make a separate section called something like "Masters of former legendary trios" like we did with the Legendary trio article and move the Regis there.

My vote goes to b, as I think it's the less ugly option. There's also the fact that an argument could be made that they stopped being a trio the moment Regigigas was introduced in Gen 4. Golden Trainer (talk) 18:11, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Like Saying Regigigas was actually a 4th member and creator?--Jacob9594 (talk) 18:50, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Yeah, an internal master like Rayquaza. People usually lump all the Regis together. Golden Trainer (talk) 20:56, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

All right, I waited and there were no objections in 3 days after I voted for removing them, so I went ahead with it. But HoennMaster saw it differently, as he reverted them back saying that "It's still under discussion".

So if you people disagree with removing them, please share your thoughts on the matter so that we actually have a discussion to go by. Golden Trainer (talk) 21:28, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

There were already multiple objections to completely removing it before you removed it. As of right now the majority supports not removing and giving it a seperate section on the page, especially until we know the relationship with Regieleki and Regidrago. --HoennMaster 02:46, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

I didn't see any objections after I brought up the issues with leaving the article in its current state and said why I believe the second of solutions I listed was the best. And I still don't see any discussion going on right now, from you or anyone. Going silent for days isn't discussing. Golden Trainer (talk) 10:21, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

All right, I'm giving it two more days before I remove it again. Don't say I didn't warn you. Golden Trainer (talk) 22:02, 14 July 2020 (UTC)

That's not how this works. As I already said, there were already multiple people who don't agree with removing it just yet. --HoennMaster 01:14, 15 July 2020 (UTC)

Those were posted before I made my argument that the article is broken in its current state and should be changed, and none of those people have rebutted said argument since then. This is a discussion, you're supposed to discuss things. If nobody tries to refute my argument or object to my proposed course of action, I can only assume that they have no issues with it. Golden Trainer (talk) 02:44, 15 July 2020 (UTC)

Gross exaggeration won’t get you any more votes here.--KnightGalarie (talk) 03:04, 15 July 2020 (UTC)

Master for every gen

There is a master for every generation, albeit some later than others. They're stil a thing! Therefore It should not be deleted, but reformed better. Necrozma800 (talk) 21:01, 14 July 2020 (UTC)