User talk:Daniel Carrero

Welcome to Bulbapedia, Daniel Carrero!

By creating your account you are now able to edit pages, join discussions, and expand the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia. Before you jump in, here are some ground rules: Be nice to everyone. It's in the code of conduct. Make good edits. Preview them before you save to make sure they're perfect the first time around. Use wikicode and link templates when adding content to a page. Use proper grammar and spelling, and read the manual of style. You can't create a userpage until you've added to the encyclopedia. It's a privilege. See the userspace policy. Use talk pages to resolve editing disputes. Don't "edit war," or constantly re-edit/undo the same thing on a page. If you have a question about something, be proactive. Take a look at our FAQ. If you're still stuck, ask for help. The staff won't bite. Sign all talk page posts with four tildes (~~~~). This will turn into your name and the time you wrote the comment. For more handy links, see the welcome portal.

Thank you, and have a good time editing here!   Mr. Daikon (talk) 22:41, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

Preview button

Hey! Next time you edit an article, you can use the preview button at the bottom left of your editing screen. This will allow you to view your edits without actually saving them officially. That way, you don't have to edit an article several times in a row. Just a heads-up. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 22:13, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for reminding me of the preview button. If that helps, I happen to know a bit about how MediaWiki wikis generally work. I've been using the preview button to some extent, though I'll try to remember to use it more often and avoid editing an article several times in a row. I'm still learning about some Bulbapedia-specific things like policies, templates and such. I've been reading the links given above, like the FAQ and other pages. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 22:36, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Oh, okay. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 23:01, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Hello

Hello. Thank you for your recent contributions to the manga sections. However, as word of advice, when writing summaries about a character's role in the story, you must use past tense instead of present tense. Second, Adventures is a very plot-heavy series unlike the mostly episodic anime. As such, it's preferred that you only reference a character's appearance in a certain chapter if it's actually relevant to the story as a whole. If all they do is appear in a chapter and nothing more, then it's best to just omit it entirely. Ataro (talk) 15:57, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Hello. OK, thanks for letting me know about these things. Thanks also for reviewing and editing the two pages I recently created--Green's parents and A.

-

About character appearances:

This makes complete sense to me, I'll remember it: "If all they do is appear in a chapter and nothing more, then it's best to just omit it entirely."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I suspect a cameo from an "unexpected" character like Professor Elm, Lanette, Brigette and others in the Epilogue might qualify to be mentioned in the character histories nonetheless.

This is different from incidental appearances, like some of Green's parents' appearances that you edited out from their article.

-

About the past tense:

I don't mind using past tense, I'm fine with using whatever style rules Bulbapedia prefers. However, I've been a little confused because it seems that (contrary to what you said above) most Pokémon Adventures character histories currently use present tense (Red, Green, Blue, Giovanni, etc.) A few use past tense (Agatha).

If it were up to me, I would suggest always using the historical present tense. I know this isn't Wikipedia and none of Wikipedia rules apply here, but I'd like to note that Wikipedia has the specific rule of using the historical present tense as said in Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Writing about fiction, basically because that's how we experience the story. It's always the "present" when you read the manga, or watch the anime, or play the game.

Anyway, that was just a suggestion. Bulbapedia:FAQ and Bulbapedia:Manual of style don't seem to mention the tense anywhere, so I'm curious about whether the website really has formal rules about it or if people have been choosing the tense based on their opinions, which would explain why some pages use the present tense and others use the past tense.

PS.: Some pages like Yellow currently seem a little messy to me, concerning the tense. That one uses mostly present tense ("She then learns of the legendary evolutionary stones") with some past tense randomly distributed around the page ("she protected the Day-Care Couple from Team Rocket"). --Daniel Carrero (talk) 17:23, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Also, please avoid adding chapter subsections for minor characters (such as Grunts) that don't really accomplish much in the story. They're mainly for important characters, as they have larger summaries and the subsection makes it more convenient to read. Ataro (talk) 03:43, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

OK. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 09:46, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

Creating articles

I forgot to tell you this earlier, but the next time you create an article like you did with Green's parents, I recommend creating a sandbox article first. That way, you can experiment with the content before it's mainspaced. Some articles require permission to create and sandboxes circumvent that a little during the wait times. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 22:18, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Alright, thank you for letting me know. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 23:10, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

You're welcome. :) GrammarFreak01 (talk) 23:16, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Going to have to remind you to create sandbox articles first before getting them mainspaced. You need permission from the staff to create articles like the ones for the Pokémon Newspaper Strip. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:25, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

I noticed you added the "cleanup" template in some of these articles. Is there anything specific you think is needed to improve them? I was promoted to the staff a few months ago. I'm currently a Junior Admin. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:37, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

Oh, you were promoted? I did not know that. You did not add any manga-related templates to the bottom of the articles, as is required for all articles. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:52, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

Alright, thanks for pointing that out. I added the manga-related templates to the bottom of these articles now. Please let me know if there's any other cleanup-related issue. For now, I removed the "cleanup" template from these articles, but if there's anything else, I don't mind readding the "cleanup" template, or cleaning them up. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 07:28, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

Okay. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 08:33, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

Creating redirects of Japanese names

Hey! I noticed you created the ミク redirect link. I'm not sure how necessary that was, because I have never seen any other redirect links for characters' Japanese names. Perhaps you need to consult an admin on that. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 04:58, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Hello. Actually I've seen quite a few redirects for characters' Japanese names before creating that one, so that appeared to be the normal thing to do.

Examples:

• アヤノ -> Andrea
• カラザ -> Christopher and Jeannie
• カルム -> Calem (game)
• アロエ -> Lenora
• サトシ -> Satoshi (disambiguation page)
• コモモ -> Kimono Girl
• ゲーチス -> Ghetsis
• ゲンゾウ -> Kenzo (EP166)
• センタ -> Senta (EP085)
• デボ -> Captain Crook
• ヒイラギ -> Rochelle
• マギー -> Melvin
• カスミ -> Misty

I've also found some some Japanese redirects for Pokémon, moves, items, places, TCG cards and so on.

The full list (katakana version) starts from ア, here it is:

• https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Special:AllPages?from=ア

The full list (hiragana version) starts from あ, here it is:

• https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Special:AllPages?from=あ

--Daniel Carrero (talk) 12:08, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Oh, okay. Never knew that. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 20:04, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Preview button again

Hey! I'm going to have to remind you to use the preview button. I notice your six edits to Seafloor are only a few minutes apart. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:44, 29 March 2019 (UTC)

You're right, sorry about that. Thanks for reminding me to use the preview button. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:45, 29 March 2019 (UTC)

You're welcome. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:46, 29 March 2019 (UTC)

Redirects

Please don't create redirects for extremely minor characters, they are unnecessary and no one would be searching for those characters. Also, don't create redirects for things that could have multiple meanings and could refer to multiple articles. Thank you.--ForceFire 05:06, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

OK. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:23, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

Game pages structure

Can we please keep the info in the games pages under the same sections for all pages? The pages were each in a different arrangement, and I've been trying to build a pattern for them. If we keep creating new sections for everything that comes to mind, it's going to become a mess again. Nothing wrong with new information, as long as we keep it organized. Suic (talk) 15:49, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Suic: OK. It looks like you are doing a good job. I appreciate that you are seeking a consistent format. I apologize if I deviated from the pattern before, it's just that I saw a mess of different arrangements as you mentioned, so I was not sure which exactly to use at the moment.

If you are interested, you may want to check generation pages like Generation I, Generation II, Generation III, etc. to see if they are able to fit the pattern. I'm only saying this because they currently repeat much of the information found in the game pages, including game features, and they have some sections in common with the game pages. But it's OK if you are not interested right now, this is just an idea. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 19:02, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

I can take a look later at the generation pages to see if they need any fix. I'll let you know then. Suic (talk) 21:40, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

OK. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 00:33, 16 May 2019 (UTC)

From what I saw, generations pages seem much more consistent with each other than games pages did. There are some minor details like the title screen sections, and generations VI and VII have some extra sections that maybe can be merged into others, but in the overall I think the pages are pretty good as they are already. Suic (talk) 02:52, 16 May 2019 (UTC)

Suic: That's good, thanks for checking. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 13:49, 16 May 2019 (UTC)

Talk page policy

Hey! You're not allowed to post on discussions whose last posts are over 6 months old. You're not guaranteed to get a response that way. If you wish to continue the discussion, start a brand-new section. Thank you! GrammarFreak01 (talk) 23:24, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

OK. I created a new discussion at Talk:Mirage Mountains. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 23:25, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

Okay, that's better. :) GrammarFreak01 (talk) 23:27, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

This is a common misconception. If you read the Talk page policy, the rule is specifically "Unless an old conversation is still relevant and there is a good reason to revitalize discussion, comments on sections older than six months old should not be made."

Six months is merely a guideline for determining when a conversation is finished. However, if there's a discussion about moving/merging/etc. a page, and the notice template is still up, then the conversation is necessarily still active. In such a case, you should be using the existing section, in order to keep the discussion in one place. --SnorlaxMonster 02:25, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

I'm confused, then. If someone posts a new comment meant to continue an old discussion, doesn't that mean the conversation is still active? If so, that rule sounds pretty redundant. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 06:29, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

The point of the policy is that normally old discussions have already been resolved, so there's no point trying to revive the discussion. But if there's still a notice template on the page, then obviously it hasn't been. --SnorlaxMonster 06:36, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

I suggest finding a way to indicate certain discussions have been closed. Sometimes I've seen people posting on old discussions that clearly have been closed. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 06:41, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

Just as a possible idea, maybe a bot could archive discussion pages automatically like Wikipedia seems to do sometimes. I'm not saying we should do it, it's just a suggestion if it helps.

About the current move discussions (Mirage Mountain, Mirage Cave, Mirage Island (Generation VI)), I guess it's reasonable to think that a discussion is still open if there's a move template still on the page. The template even says: "Please discuss whether or not to move it on its talk page."

But maybe these moves should have been done already. These discussions are open since 2015. Few people replied yet, but everyone seems to agree with the moves so far. This could change, but there's been 100% support so far. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 13:24, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

There's also the rule from Bulbapedia:Manual of style: "In most cases, titles referring to a specific group should be kept singular, such as item rather than items." --Daniel Carrero (talk) 13:29, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

Formatting

Hey! Please don't use redirect links to link to articles. For example, [[anime]] is not the appropriate usage; {{pkmn|anime}} is. If you want further info, please consult the list of templates. Thank you. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:43, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

Alright, thanks for fixing that. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:48, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

I had not realized yet that [[anime]] is not the appropriate usage. Thanks for letting me know. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:49, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

You're welcome. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:49, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

I just told you not to use redirect links to link to articles and you still did it anyway. Please review the list of templates, or simply open the link in another tab to check it before saving the edit first. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 06:02, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

OK. I should have checked that edit properly. My intention was just restoring the titles and formatting them as wikitext headings. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 06:06, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

I already fixed them a while back. Please be mindful of how something is linked and try not to change it unless you already know the original link is a redirect. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 06:08, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

OK, I understand. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 06:25, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

It's two talk pages in a row, I'm going to say the same thing here as on Raltseye's talk page: please don't suggest direct links are always better than redirects, especially not to other users; it's a misconception. I mean, generally, yes, they're better (so please be careful, Daniel), but there's no rule that always requires the use of templates or direct links, and that's a good thing (if you seek more detailed reasons why, please start where I linked to, and then click some links I posted there).

Quite certainly, I would've linked [[Trainer class]] myself (at least had there been no link before). Nescientist (talk) 08:44, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

Nescientist - I see. Thank you too.

I guess in practice some of these redirects don't hurt. They point to the same page anyway. Then again, it would be a problem if we started having multiple pages named "Trainer class" for some reason (which is a hypothetical). I see that the templates are better. I'll remember to use the templates. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 21:28, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

No problem. I believe using direct links (and templates) should be the default; if you deviate and decide to use redirects, you should have a reason. (...and/but changing redirects to direct links should be carefully considered, too.) Nescientist (talk) 22:32, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

Disambiguation pages

I can tell you like making disambiguation pages, but please consider their purpose. They should be a list of pages that someone searching for a given term could conceivably be intending to find with a given search term. So for example, someone searching Red could quite likely be looking for a page like Pokémon Red and Blue Versions or Red (game), but I don't think they would actually be looking for Red Card. Please keep this in mind, and don't just make disambiguation pages for the sake of it. --SnorlaxMonster 11:31, 26 September 2019 (UTC)

OK, I understand. I'll keep this in mind. I'll slow down on creating disambiguation pages. I'm thinking my main focus at the moment should be the TCG games for GBC. Maybe I should also do some research concerning friendship in various generations, since that page has a request at the top. I edited the friendship information and values for Generation I recently.

Anyway, if I'm not mistaken, the page Red was pretty big even before I touched it: Red - revision from 3 May 2019.

That page already had Red Chain, Red Scale, and Red Gummi. It's true I added Red Card there. I guess I saw a pattern. As in, if we had a disambig page with those 3 prior items, then I guessed at the time that Red Card fits as well. But that could be just me. Again, I'll slow down on disambig pages. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 14:42, 26 September 2019 (UTC)

Splitting/Moving

If you want to split or move a page, you must ask for permission on the talk page first, do not go splitting/moving the page without staff permission. Thank you.--ForceFire 04:33, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

Specifically, the talk page of the article in question. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 04:45, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

I recently created about 99% of the spin-off content at Pokédex that I had moved to Pokédex (spin-off games). Here's the Pokédex article before I touched it: revision 3033369.

I could have created the separate spin-off page in the first place instead of adding it to Pokédex and then removing it a few days later. That said, OK, I asked for permission at the talk page now. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:00, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

Pinball

Hey, it's really great that you're adding information about Pinball, but could I ask that when you do on item pages, you include a bit more detail? I haven't played the Pinball games, so I find the item descriptions somewhat lacking.

For example, on the Fire Stone page, you added "the player gets three Fire Stone symbols". How does the player get these symbols? Are symbols the equivalent of items in Pinball (and thus have their own page)?

Likewise, on Master Ball, you mentioned that the Master Ball gives a higher points multiplier. How do you get a Master Ball, and how do you use it?

Basically, I would really appreciate it if you could write sections so that someone who hasn't played the game can gain an understanding of what the subject's role in Pinball is. --SnorlaxMonster 01:02, 26 October 2019 (UTC)

Alright, I think I understand. I'll see what I can do to write content for people who haven't played the game. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 02:54, 26 October 2019 (UTC)

Do you think symbols could have their own page? I think the different language Experience symbols are a bit excessive on the pages they are currently present on, but on a generic symbol page they would make perfect sense. --SnorlaxMonster 09:48, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

OK, I see what you mean. I created Evolution Items (Pinball) now. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 18:36, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

Redirect edit request

BlackDiamondShipping is protected, but the linked page redirects to a redirect page (after I moved List of nevermet shippings to Nevermet shippings because ArcToraphim forgot to move the so-called "shipping redirect"). Please fix that. --TheICTLiker4 19:05, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

You MUSTN'T have redirected to the page in the Shipping namespace. Please fix that. AGAIN. --TheICTLiker4 19:15, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Look again. Is this what you had in mind? Let me know if that page needs anything else. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 19:18, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, thank you. --TheICTLiker4 19:19, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

You're welcome. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 19:22, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

Preview button/Pokémon template reminder

Hey! Just so you know, you used a regular link for the Squirtle article as opposed to the regular {{p}} template. Please make sure you preview the links you use before actually publishing your edit. Thank you. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:14, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

OK, thanks for fixing that link. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 06:09, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

You're welcome. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 23:16, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Template Approval

Hey, I was wondering if you could please check over and, if they're all good, approve some templates I made for this page. They're templates for Alolan and Galarian forms that simply put a little (Alolan) or (Galarian) under the Pokémon's name for the regional forms in the list. Thanks in advance!
These are the templates:
Avail-1A
Avail-1G
Avail-2G
Avail-3G
Avail-5G
Gameskiller01 (talk) 23:11, 21 June 2020 (UTC)

Hi. I edited the existing templates, now they automatically recognize if the current form is Alolan or Galarian based on the "A" or "G" of the Pokémon number. :) So I think maybe we won't need multiple new separate "Avail" templates for that purpose. Thanks anyway for all your work on the availability page, I appreciate it very much. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 00:36, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, that works perfectly and is even better than what I was trying to do. If I'd known that was possible I would've done that instead haha. And it's no problem, I use the page frequently myself so I figured it was about time I started contributing to it. Gameskiller01 (talk) 00:42, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

Congratulations!

Congratulations on the staff promotion! --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 20:14, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Thank you! :) --Daniel Carrero (talk) 20:15, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Unknown Origins Pokémon Template Approval

Hey, as I discussed here I thought it could be a good idea to move Meltan & Melmetal to their own little section on this page because of their unique status, or alternatively move the Let's Go games as a whole to their own section. I felt like the former suggestion would be the easiest and likely least controversial for now, so I created this template, which can be seen in use here in the Sandbox, and I was wondering if you could check over and, if everything's all good, approve the template for use in the main page. Thanks in advance! Gameskiller01 (talk) 13:12, 9 October 2020 (UTC)

Gameskiller01 - Hey, thanks for the ideas. :) I think moving Meltan and Melmetal to a separate section looks like an improvement in the availability page. I moved your template to the main namespace and tried to use it in that page. Please check if it all looks OK.

That said, I think we probably shouldn't move Let's Go games to their own section in the availability page. Almost all the Pokémon available in LGPE are Gen 1 Pokémon, which can simply be found in the Gen 1 table. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 13:22, 12 October 2020 (UTC)

Thank you, that's brilliant. I did make some small tweaks to keep the sections' consistency with the rest of the page, most notably changing the name of the section from "Meltan & Melmetal" to "Unknown Origins Pokémon", since that matches better with the rest of the article and is their official designation in Pokémon Home, but overall I really like the change.
I do agree that we shouldn't move the Let's Go games to their own section, at least not for now. I think that if more Let's Go games get released in the future then the idea could be worth coming back to, but for now I think it works perfectly the way it is. Gameskiller01 (talk) 14:18, 12 October 2020 (UTC)

NIWA FEW

Hey, looks like the link template for Fire Emblem Wiki + links to the FEW main page need to be updated. As I mentioned on the NIWA talk page, the URL for the main page changed some time ago and now every instance of the link 404s. RotaRaichu (talk) 01:13, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

I see, thanks for letting me know. Looks like this would involve changing the link associated with the shortcut "few:" in the MediaWiki database. This is something I can't do, so I contacted other admins to look into that. From what I see, if the "few:" shortcut is updated, the link template itself (Template:Few) probably won't need to be edited. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 03:05, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Template Moveentrytm

Hey, could I replace this template [1] on Egg Group pages with regular table? It is impossible to add Pikachu in a hat there, for example. Seems like this template is pointless as it is used almost only on egg group pages and uses too much code to work specifically for every Pokemon with special form.--Rocket Grunt 23:48, 21 December 2020 (UTC)

User:Team Rocket Grunt - Hey, sorry I took some time to reply.

I think you're right about this template... Yes, it has too much code for a simple task, I think. But in defense of that template, at least it provides some uniform formatting for multiple pages, so I'm hoping we could keep the template anyway. We can probably also improve the template, and/or make its code shorter. At least that's my opinion.

I tried to improve the template today, to some extent. The template code should be a little more readable now. I also basically merged Template:Moveentry and Template:Moveentrytm because they were almost identical anyway (but each template was missing some forms the other template had).

I added Pikachu in a cap in the template, to be used in No Eggs Discovered (Egg Group). Please let me know if the template is missing any other Pokémon forms. :) --Daniel Carrero (talk) 04:28, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

Wow, thank you very much. Talking about formatting, I would suggest instead to make a universal guide on page like Bulbapedia:Manual of style.--Rocket Grunt 18:21, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

You're welcome. :)

Oh, you mean like an official formatting guide for templates? That would be nice, it could potentially improve our templates. My opinion is that several Bulbapedia templates look good when used on pages but their code is often a big mess and difficult to edit.

I've been thinking that Bulbapedia should probably enable Lua (Extension:Scribunto). If the "Moveentry" templates were converted to Lua, the code could be potentially cleaner as Pokémon forms could be stored in a separate page for use by multiple templates. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 23:55, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

Move Infobox

Hey, I would like to make another suggestion, but I am not sure who should I talk to. I discovered that in Move Infobox, like the one used on page [2], there are flags of moves which haven't been really updated since generation III. I've also found these pages [3] [4] that show all flags there are in games now. I am not even sure if the flags are really necessary in the infobox and how staff would like to solve this.

Flags
Makes contact Affected by Protect and Detect Affected by Magic Coat and Magic Bounce Affected by Snatch Affected by Mirror Move Affected by King's Rock and Razor Fang Thaws out user Aura and pulse moves Ball and bomb moves Biting moves Dance moves Powder and spore moves Punching moves Sound-based moves
Potential flags:
Explosive moves (Damp) Mental moves (Aroma Veil) Healing moves (Heal Block) Affected by Gravity Bypasses Substitute Thaws out target Breaks natural objects Field move Not/Affected by type immunites Can't be selected by Sleep Talk Can't be selected by Mimic Can't be selected by Sketch Can't be selected by Conversion 2 Can't be selected by Copycat Can't be selected by Me First Can't be selected by Assist Can't be selected by Metronome Can't be selected by Encore Hits Pokemon in Bounce, Fly or Sky Drop Hits Pokemon in Dive Hits Pokemon in Dig Has charge turn Has recharge turn

While we are on the Move Infobox, I think contest combinations could be easily put in the infobox too, insteaf of being written in the "Effect" section of the move.

Contest combination:

• DragonBreath → Dragon Dance
• Dragon Rage → Dragon Dance

• Dragon Dance → DragonBreath
• Dragon Dance → Dragon Claw
• Dragon Dance → Dragon Rage

--Rocket Grunt 00:00, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Hey TRG. I see you've sent this almost 2 months ago. I apologize for replying now rather than sooner. I think I didn't see your message before, or forgot to reply sooner.

This seems to be about Template:MoveInfobox.

I'd like to note that in several cases, all moves would share the same value, but some moves are exceptions with the opposite value. Examples:

• Most moves are not dance moves, but a few moves are dance moves.
• Most moves are not ball and bomb moves, but a few moves are.
• Most moves don't have a recharge turn, but some have.
• Most moves don't hit a Pokémon in Dive, but some hit.
• Most moves don't hit through Protect, but some hit.
• Most moves can be copied with Mimic, but some can't.

With this in mind, I wonder if we would have to edit hundreds of moves to say "this does NOT hit a Pokémon in Dive, this does NOT hit a Pokémon in Fly, this does NOT hit through Protect, this CAN be copied by Mimic, this CAN be selected by Metronome"... that is, this would be the default anyway. This would bloat the template call in the wikitext, and would also occupy lots of space in the resulting page.

A different idea would be just adding the parameter to the few moves that deviate from the norm. Thunder hits a Pokémon with Fly, Surf hits a Pokémon with Dive, Gyro Ball is a ball/bomb move, Swords Dance is a dance move, etc.

On the other hand, most moves simply state what they do in the "Effect" section. I think this looks pretty good, maybe even better than using template parameters for that. For instance, Thunder already states its effect when used on a Pokémon that is flying, Surf already states its effect on a Pokémon that is diving, Gyro Ball states "Pokémon with Bulletproof are immune to Gyro Ball.", etc. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 15:11, 20 February 2021 (UTC)

Redirect fix

I just noticed that hundreds of pages, mostly past generation learnsets, that have the Move Tutor link incorrectly typed as "Move tutor", creating a redirect. Could you or some other admin perhaps fix this? --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 21:23, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

Ok, looks like this is done now. I edited those hundreds of pages and changed the link from move tutor to Move Tutor. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 08:44, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 09:54, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

You're welcome. :) --Daniel Carrero (talk) 10:18, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Transform glitches

Just FYI, from what I understood with the levelup thing in Emerald, what happened is that the game recalculated the stats rather than the moveset using the original species; in Ditto's case it would be a 48 across the board instead of whatever it's using in the Transformed state. (then again it's been a while since I've watched that video) Eridanus (talk) 08:33, 23 February 2021 (UTC) PS. base 48 applied to the stat formula (aside from HP), I mean. Eridanus (talk) 08:36, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

Emerald? That page does not mention any G3 glitch at the moment. Maybe it's some other glitch that could be added in the future?

Anyway, there's a level-up glitch from G1 explained in the page. In Red/Blue/Yellow, if a transformed Pokémon levels up and learns a new move (such as a transformed Mew reaching level 20 and learning Mega Punch), the whole moveset is reverted, except the PP of all moves still use Transform rules (that is, they can lose PP but that does not affect their "real" PP as shown in the summary). It's pretty odd, and the article itself explains with more details. I've tested this one myself. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 10:02, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

You seem to have removed it while testing a different level-up quirk. Eridanus (talk) 10:24, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

Oops, sorry. Yes, I see now that I removed that line by mistake that day. I copied it on Transform glitches now. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 10:36, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

Regrading Lighting Force

I Tried to change the He do not know anything to Doesn't Know anything--Leokids (Splash!) (talk) 18:45, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hello. Would you mind explain your recent edits starting on March 1? Your edit history indicates no talk page discussion and community consensus has been pursued in regards to this style change, as far as I know. Either way, I must say that I personally disagree with the style change. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 14:10, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello? I'd like an explanation behind this. I know you were active just several minutes ago. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 14:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

1) I believe it was a bot used by DC doing the edits.

2) Personally, I'm indifferent towards these edits atm. I can see where DC is coming from. For example, character history sections can have subsections for different "eras", and they don't use the "in the" part. However, I can also see that it's conflicting with the "In the" part of the section's main title. --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 14:22, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Regardless, I feel like this should have been discussed with the broader community first. This was absolutely unexpected and honestly a little rude of them to force this onto us without advance warning. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 14:23, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Daniel? Care for some clarification, please? GrammarFreak01 (talk) 14:54, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Patience. Daniel is clearly not present ATM. --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 15:00, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi, Daniel. Can I help with this, or will a programmed bot be doing this automatically? Because I noticed that it will be a huge job for one person.Hikaru Wazana (talk) 15:02, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey, thanks for the offer. Anyway, maybe it's best to wait a while while this is discussed here. I also stopped editing the articles for now. If this is approved, feel free to edit any entry using that format if you want. I've been using semi-automated edits so it's easier for me than editing each entry manually. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 15:11, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello. Just to be clear, it was not a bot. The edits were semi-automatic, meaning I had to be online and personally approve each edit.

I had just discussed this idea with other admins outside the wiki for now. I wonder where in the wiki we could have discussed this? In the talk page of some character? Maybe not in the wiki but in the forums? Anyway, we can discuss this here.

I understand that multiple media have been using different title styles. They generally have been like this:

In the games
Pokémon Red and Blue
Pokémon Gold and Silver
Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire

In the anime
In Pokémon Origins
In Pokémon Generations

In the manga
In the Pokémon Adventures manga
In the Pokémon Pocket Monsters manga
In the Magical Pokémon Journey manga

This format is very inconsistent. Why "In the" for manga titles, "In" for anime titles and nothing for game titles? Why the word "manga" at the end of the manga but not "games" for the games and "anime" for the anime?

For example, if we wanted to use the manga format everywhere, the result would be:

In the games
In the Pokémon Red and Blue games
In the Pokémon Gold and Silver games
In the Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire games

In the anime
In the Pokémon Origins anime
In the Pokémon Generations anime

In the manga
In the Pokémon Adventures manga
In the Pokémon Pocket Monsters manga
In the Magical Pokémon Journey manga

As another example, if we wanted to use the anime format everywhere, the result would be:

In the games
In Pokémon Red and Blue
In Pokémon Gold and Silver
In Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire

In the anime
In Pokémon Origins
In Pokémon Generations

In the manga
In Pokémon Adventures
In Pokémon Pocket Monsters
In Magical Pokémon Journey

The third example would be using the game format everywhere:

In the games
Pokémon Red and Blue
Pokémon Gold and Silver
Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire

In the anime
Pokémon Origins
Pokémon Generations

In the manga
Pokémon Adventures
Pokémon Pocket Monsters
Magical Pokémon Journey

I've been implementing the third format in some entries. It's definitely redundant to have an "In the manga" section but also add "In the" and "manga" to each manga title. Do you disagree? Maybe you would keep everything as it was? Would you use another title format?

As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't have to be exactly this title format if there are any better ideas. But I do think this change was a big improvement over the status quo. I hope I can finish editing the articles. That said, on the other hand, I am also able to use the AutoWikiBrowser to undo all my edits, or implement some other title format, if needed. If there's any interest in discussing this, feel free to discuss. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 15:11, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Daniel has already said this, but just for clarity, this was discussed + agreed upon with the other admins, and not just a spur-of-the-moment mass edit.

In the future, admins should bring it up publicly as well, but if you have an issue with these types of admin edits, bringing it up on talk pages should always be the first step before just undoing the edits. --celadonk (talk) 15:39, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Good to hear. I assumed it had been discussed. I personally see no reason for this project not to continue. --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 15:54, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

I understood the point of the changes, I think that even the texts of the characters' stories should be revised too. They use that same structure there ...

Like, I don't know, the page of a recurring character is always ...

In the episode X, that character did something.

In the episode Y, the character did something more.

In the episode Z, a character did such a thing.

In comparison, look at the Food Wars wiki[5] or Yugi-Oh wiki[6]. I think that very few pages of the characters follow a structure really like this, like ... comparing Paul's page with Gary Oak's. I'm not talking about copying these wikis, because the format of the anime is different, but reviewing the content and making it more professional with a chronology of the character I think would make it better.

Anyway, I'm just saying that I agree with Daniel to look for a more "clean" way to present the content. I don't know if my opinion would help that, but anyway ...--Hikaru Wazana (talk) 16:02, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey people, thanks for the ideas. Hikaru, this reminds me that the Harry Potter wiki uses lots of reference footnotes in the history of each character. (Example: Ronald Weasley)

Some rivals such as Gary Oak may appear every once in a while, so we mention some of the episodes where they appear. Maybe using footnotes would be an improvement so we could focus on reading the story, and only check their sources if we want.

Current format:

Gary appeared in a flashback to Ash's childhood in Lights, Camerupt, Action!.

Footnote format:

Gary appeared in a flashback to Ash's childhood.[1]

==References==
* 1: Lights, Camerupt, Action!

Anyway, I like the Yu-Gi-Oh! Wiki mainly because of their card database. However, I think it's good to link to each episode in some way as a source for our statements. If there are any fandom wikis that just present character histories without linking to their evidence, I don't suppose Bulbapedia should take their lead and remove episode links too, right? Instead, maybe these wikis would be improved by adding episode links like we do here (or the footnote format that the Harry Potter Wiki uses). :) --Daniel Carrero (talk) 17:18, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

Didn't see these new messages; I wasn't notified via email. Anyway, Celadonkey, I didn't think these edits would be so widespread until I got deeper into Daniel's editing and then SnorlaxMonster stepped in, hence all the undone edits. That aside, it's good to know the admins signed off on this and this wasn't some spur-of-the-moment thing, but I do wish the admins found a way to let everyone else know about this development. I personally do not agree with this new style, but if the admins approve of this, then who am I to disagree? GrammarFreak01 (talk) 11:00, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey, GrammarFreak. This is simply the old game style (like sections titled "Pokémon FireRed and LeafGreen"), but being also applied to the manga and anime as well. Don't you think consistency between anime, manga, and games is a good thing? Isn't it very redundant to add "In the" and "manga" to each manga title?

If you disagree, I don't mind discussing and checking if it all looks good. I'm curious to know if you would want to keep exactly the old style as it was. My impression is that the old style was just a mix of wildly different and undiscussed styles applied by different people, so I was simply trying to clean up and standardize the previous mess if possible. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 11:28, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Honestly, I personally think "In the Pokémon FireRed and LeafGreen games" is a more preferable style. But if the admins signed off on another option, then I'm not going to argue anymore. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 11:33, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Hi, I liked the way you put it. With the references, indicating, I myself have been trying a new way to approach the chronology of the characters. I did it on the page I set up on Korrina and today I'm trying to approach it with my Bea page in the anime. Regarding the changes about sections, I would adopt the change proposed by Daniel.

Will this be the format from now on?--Hikaru Wazana (talk) 12:35, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

I like this footnote format too. I'm checking with other admins to see if this format can be approved. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 13:32, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

As far as I know, looks like we won't be linking to the episodes using the footnote format mentioned above (and also used a lot by the Harry Potter wiki) as it does not seem approved by the admins. It seems we still need to say the episode titles in running text like "In the episode X, Gary battled Ash." --Daniel Carrero (talk) 14:44, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

Is adding chapter subsections necessary even when there's only one chapter something appears in? Was that also something that was discussed? --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 08:21, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey, Finnish. So we are talking about chapter subsections like these:

===Pokémon Adventures===
===={{chap|Red, Green & Blue}}====
===={{chap|Emerald}}====
===={{chap|HeartGold & SoulSilver}}====
===={{chap|X & Y}}====

Some pages would have only one chapter subsection. For instance, it seems the Focus Sash is only used in the Platinum chapter:

===Pokémon Adventures===
===={{chap|Platinum}}====

OK, I'll answer your question. No, I didn't discuss yet about specifically adding chapter subsections when there's only one chapter.

But I think there's something interesting here: We have some sort of rule about adding chapter subsections when two or more are needed? I don't think this was ever really discussed, right?

I think what happened is this: In 2019, I started adding a bunch of manga chapter subsections to all characters and items, and then GrammarFreak reverted a bunch of them that had only one chapter subsection (example 1, example 2), so I stopped adding them and focused on the articles with two or more. Long story short, it seems some sort of (undiscussed) tradition was born where it seems OK to add chapter subsections when two or more are needed.

At least in my opinion, I think it's helpful to add chapter subsections to all these articles (regardless of how many chapter subsections, including one as you asked). The Pokémon Adventures story is very long and clearly separated in arcs. It is also often sold around the world as separate manga based on those arcs anyway. You can buy the "Black and White manga volume 3" or something. So I think it helps to easily see that the Focus Sash only appears in the HGSS chapter.

Well, I don't mind discussing and checking what would be the best format. I've started a discussion now with other admins (outside the wiki) about the chapter subsections, in particular these pages that would only need one chapter subsection (like Focus Sash). --Daniel Carrero (talk) 14:44, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

I think the format of the manga characters is good, In fact, I think the stories of each character should follow the layout of the characters' pages in the manga more. In anime you can also do something like that with some of the characters with their own pages. I thought of suggesting something like I saw in the wikis I mentioned ... using Gary for example.

===In the anime===
====Original series====
=====Indigo League Conference=====
=====Journey in Johto=====
=====Silver Conference=====

Or Leon...

===In the anime===
====As a Monarc====
=====Sword & Shield arc=====
[[File:JN044.png|250px|thumb|Leon facing Eternatus]](Here, I would like to represent, I don't know, an image referring to a key moment of the event mentioned.

I think that even we should review the way that it deals with flashback appearances too. Like, there are flashbacks that don't add anything to the plot of any character, I mean a flashback that shows that Bea fought with Korrina shows more about the two characters, a Flashback that shows that Ash is interested in fighting with Leon, does not add anything to Leon's plot. A Flashback that shows that Diantha had a Ralts and participated in a competition is useful, a flashback that shows the fight that Raihan had with Leon just to remember what is Gigantamax is kind of useless. In short, just as they do to talk about a Trainer's Pokémon(Like, we don't put a "Pikachu flashed in JN100 battling Paul's Growlithe"), there are notable and notable flashbacks.

Anyway, they are just suggestions, maybe the team knows better than I do their viability or not.

--Hikaru Wazana (talk) 15:40, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey, thanks for the ideas. Looks like we generally separate articles by each anime series like this:

===In the anime===
====[[Original series]]====
====''[[Pokémon the Series: Ruby and Sapphire]]''====
====''[[Pokémon the Series: Diamond and Pearl]]''====

Gary Oak has a few sections like these. You see, these titles like "Pokémon the Series: Ruby and Sapphire" may be considered separate anime in the same continuity. But we don't usually have sections like "Indigo League Conference" and "Journey in Johto", meaning anime seasons or stories that are simply part of each anime series, instead of being actual separate anime series.

And now about flashbacks: Sure, I think. Some flashbacks may be more notable than others. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 16:13, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

I went and reversed some of your edits before coming here to talk with you about them. My apologies. Feel free to restore them. --FinnishPokéFan92 (talk) 19:15, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

OK, no problem. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 19:30, 7 March 2021 (UTC)

Hello, may I also suggest for the trainer classes pages, specifically from the manga section, since a couple of pages have a gallery of their Pokemon rather than the boxes that's on some of others.Animaltamer7 (talk) 03:57, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey, I think I didn't understand this suggestion. lol

Anyway, I've been changing "In the Pokémon Adventures manga" to "Pokémon Adventures" in trainer class pages too, like Swimmer. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 16:02, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Sorry I meant a suggestion for after this subsection changes, wherein pages like the Ace Trainer and the Beauty trainer classes have pokemon section that aren't in the same format like in several other trainer class pages.Animaltamer7 (talk) 23:21, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Oh sure, the larger tables listing all the Pokémon can probably be added in those articles. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 23:30, 8 March 2021 (UTC)