Talk:DP086

win

guess Ash wins since they leave the city next ep.--Davidaipom 20:17, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

I doubt Ash even met Fantina in this episode. Usually all the episodes were Ash fights someone are "(blah blah) Gym! VS. (blah blah blah)!!" They probably went there and Fantina didn't come back yet so they are moving on. The details given don't even hint a gym battle. --☆ケンジガール 01:18, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Although the anime is different then the game, in the games you go through Hearthome to Celestic and back after you get the HM for Surf from Cynthia's grandmother. So they might follow that route and then go back to Hearthome for Ash's badge and on to Canalave.^Psychic_Rider 01:22, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Jump kick

It looks like lopunny and buneary use jump kick in this episode. PL12 14:34, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Ending?

For the one I watched, it wasnt Poka Poka, it was the original. same with last week. Mooites 00:17, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Dude.

Is Piplup hot for Buneary?! TTEchidna 05:52, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, both Piplup and Buneary are in the Ground egg group. I don't know how Buneary would handle being caught in a triangle with Piplup and Pikachu.

Then again, I don't know how a certain group of fans would react upon hearing evidence of Dawn's Piplup possibly being male when they believe the DP061 outfits were clear evidence of it being female. This same group thinks the same of Pachirisu, clearly ignoring its male-length head stripe. At the rate we're going, odds are we're probably going to get either a gender confirmation (ala Buneary and Ambipom) or conflicting evidence (ala Piplup and Pachirisu) on Swinub sooner or later...--Shiningpikablu252 06:17, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Countdown?

Nothing? MathijsP 12:01, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Huh? TTEchidna 19:25, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Toxicroak

I guess Saturn's Toxicroak isn't shiny. Dean

How do you know THAT Toxicroak wasn't shiny as well? I'm Missingno. Master, and I approve this message. 18:14, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Hopefully they will make an episode with many Toxicroak so we can be 100% certain. I don't see that happening though... ~$aturn¥oshi ^{THE VOICES} 18:22, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

For all we know, Saturn could have lent his Toxicroak for the collection. For all we know, that rocker borrowed the Toxicroak from Saturn.

Alternately, it could just mean that Toxicroak is probably the most common alternate-coloration in the anime world (trust me, the in-episode evidence for DP069 points to Saturn's Toxicroak indeed being of alternate-coloration, right down to having a special emergence effect; the ones who say it is for sure not cite how a normal-colored Noctowl appeared on the Pokédex when Ash scanned the alternate-colored one, when Ash never scanned the alternate-colored one). Trust me, if Brock's Croagunk evolves, that'll prove Saturn's Toxicroak is of alternate-coloration--the only non-alternate-coloration to evolve into an alternate-coloration happened due to Team Rocket interference.

Regardless, odds are people will continue defending their stance on Toxicroak. For all we know, the DP086 Toxicroak could also be a coloring error like the DP076 preview Snorlax. --Shiningpikablu252 18:33, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

I dont get it. In the Sinnoh Pokémon handbook that my friend has it has all the Sinnoh Pokémon as they would be in the anime. Toxicroak was the same color as Saturn's and this one. Mooites 01:27, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

"For all we know, Saturn could have lent his Toxicroak for the collection. For all we know, that rocker borrowed the Toxicroak from Saturn."

That has to be the lamest idea yet. So basically what people are saying is that until a third Toxicroak appears, we are still going to assume it is shiny?

----HoennMaster 03:40, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Face facts. The writers obviously screwed up the anime's Toxicroaks and made them all shiny. It's the Θρtιmαtum♏_Talk|Links03:45 12 Jul 2008

Actually, theres been a few coloration errors. a lot of pokemon are lighter or darker than there sprites. this is probably just a coincidence that the anime colors are the same as the shiny ones. Mooites 04:15, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Guys, should the fact that Fantina leaving the gym despite that kind of behavior would lead to it being shut down be mentioned in the Error's section?

I'm asking because I tried it before, and yet Kenji-girl felt that I shouldn't just because "it MIGHT have different rules". I tried to tell her that if it really had different rules, then hoenn and Johto wouldn't have the PIA inspecting the gyms, and Mr. Goodshow wouldn't be hosting them, yet she still insists. I tried to do it, but she wouldn't let me. I mean, the rules for the OI are most certainly different (half of the gym leaders requirements for gaining the badge actually DID involve battling, not counting drake), but the rules for the Gym battles in Kanto, Johto, Hoenn, and Sinnoh were still similar. can you settle this for us? I really feel that it should be noted. Weedle Mchairybug 13:37, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

You can't prove that the rules are the same in Sinnoh, so no its not an error. If you want to mention it in trivia, that's fine. --☆ケンジガール 20:39, 28 July 2008 (UTC

Even if I can't prove that the rules are the same in Sinnoh, you ALSO can't prove that they aren't the same. Actually, I have evidence that would at LEAST give it solid grounds. First off, PIA agent Joy mentioned to Misty that she is going to inspect Hoenn in Cerulean Blue, Now, since the Hoenn region is miles away from the Kanto-net, then it gives some credence that Sinnoh would ALSO have these same rules.

Also, for the second piece of evidence, Mr. Goodshow was hosting the leagues in Kanto, Johto, and Hoenn. Since he is the guy who runs and operates the Pokemon League, he also runs the PIA, which regulates Gyms to see if they are worthy of being Gyms at least, and at most will have the power to actually wipe them clean off the map.

Lastly, the Maylene battle referenced a concept of Gym leaders that was mentioned in Season 1, and mentioned by Whittney in Johto. That concept is that the Gym leader has the authority to determine if a challenger is worthy of a badge, if not by winning against them, then at least by showing admirable qualities that shows they earned it.

If you still wish to think that they don't have the same rules, fine. But I've given ample amount of evidence about it that at least makes it sway towards that direction. Weedle Mchairybug 20:53, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

You're still neglecting to even think about other reasons why it may not be the same. What if Fantina has special privileges because she is a coordinator that she can leave the gym alone for a long period of time. Or you don't know if Fantina came back in the time period Ash left Hearthome the first time and came back the second time. Face it. There is not enough evidence to prove this error. Saying that its true for Kanto, Johto, and Hoenn is not enough. Besides, the Pokémon anime is always contradicting itself anyway. The only place that this is worth noting is in the trivia. Errors is only for things that can be proven without a shadow of a doubt. --☆ケンジガール 21:02, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

The only reason the gym is closed is because the writers are actually trying to FOLLOW the games to some extent. Should they have given Ash Fantina's badge the moment he arrived in Hearthome? No, as it is the fifth badge, not the third or fourth. The last time gyms were done out of order was back in *Kanto*. In the games, it is required to visit Celestic Town as well before challenging the gym. I also agree with Kenji-girl, she makes some good points. It is not an error, it is simply the writers following the games. Are they supposed to have Ash do things out of order just because of a small thing that came up in Chronicles? I don't think so. Pikapi 21:10, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

They could have had Ash challenge Fantina, and end up being beaten by her, You know, like what happened when Ash lost against Brendan. they could have done ANYTHING just to not have Fantina challenge Ash yet, just as long as it doesn't break PIA rules and regulations (like leaving the Gym unattended, or refusing a challenger's request to battle [which was what happened in the games.].).

And anyways, considering how the majority of the fanbase uses that episode, as well as how her sisters are incompetant, as a justification as to why Misty can't return to the main cast in-universe, I'd argue that this was important enough to have Ash do it out of order.

Also, Kenji-girl, considering how the PIA is strict about their policy about Gym evaluations, I don't think being a coordinator is going to warrant as an excuse to neglect the gym responsibilities. I mean, otherwise, Cerulean Gym would NOT have been in danger of being shut down. Besides, Giovanni, as far as they were concerned, was a CEO, and his being a CEO didn't save him from being evicted from his Gym.

Besides, the Route 25 thing wasn't an error beyond a doubt either, since they offered an alternative explaination. Should we erase that as well? And since the Anime is always contradicting itself, then there's no point for an errors section, now is there? Weedle Mchairybug 21:34, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Uh... When did Ash fight Brendan? Anyway, you can't seem to give any other reason than "I don't think this" or "I don't think that". Everything your using for reasons are speculatory. If they actually said that Fantina herself would be evicted, THEN it would be an error. But they didn't. It belongs in trivia, not errors. It can't be proven. --☆ケンジガール 21:42, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Oh, sorry, I meant Norman, not Brendan. and, hey. the GSDS thing can't be proven, either, and that never stopped IT from becoming it's own article. the Future Generations article, by your logic, ALSO shouldn't even exist since we don't have any evidence of there actually BEING a new generation. and, hey! how about the reasons why the 4kids group left? that was also speculatory and also didn't prove which reason was true, should we remove the article about that controversy in question as well? Most of the Shipping articles aren't even PROVEN, they only have evidence. Why didn't you remove those, then, if you truly feel that it should only be on Bulbapedia if it is proven without doubt? How about we just try and remove ALL things on this wiki that deal with speculative nature (even VA comments, which, if it can suit your views, even Mayumi Iizuka's blog), just to suit your desires! I tried to be as calm and collected about this, and I TRIED to explain my rationale as to why this should be mentioned, but you feel as though you should block it just because there is no evidence that it's an error (even though you have absolutely no qualms about articles such as the ones above existing even though they aren't proven without a shadow of a doubt), but I am on the verge of the breaking point. If you don't mind such articles as the ones listed above existing and more, you also shouldn't mind if there are things that can't be proven being mentioned on here, since, as they always say, "what's good for the goose is good for the gander". Weedle Mchairybug 21:56, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

I'm not saying don't mention it. I just said don't put it in errors. Put it in trivia. Like the supposite Pokémon League entrance exam. They said all leagues had this yet Kanto was the only league with this test. I mentioned this in trivia, not errors cause I know the writers like to change their mind after a while. And shipping articles are on a different name space so you can't count them. Personally I don't even no why we have the GSDS article. --☆ケンジガール 22:01, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

I have to agree with Kenji-girl. Even if the rules in Sinnoh were the same as in Kanto, Johto, and Hoenn, this STILL wouldn't belong in the 'error' section. It belongs in the Trivia section, where all interesting things go. Sheesh, if you won't do it and quit complaining, then I will!
ShinjiLover 09:12, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Ok, then it's settled. BTW, in regards to the "PIA not having authority in Sinnoh", let's just say we'll leave it in until Ash participates in the Sinnoh League (Because regional leagues are when their boss, Mr. Goodshow, appears.). If he doesn't appear, keep it in, but if he DOES appear, remove it. Deal? Weedle Mchairybug 12:44, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Ok, Mr. Goodshow has appeared in the league, and as I have said in regards to our little deal, we have to remove that part. Mr. Goodshow may not be a direct member, but he is still their boss and thus ultimately the one who calls the shots. I mean, if he is the head of the entire Pokemon League, the PIA can determine whether Gyms can be officially sanctioned for the league [as stated in Showdown at Dark City]/shut down a Gym, and Gyms are the only way barring a testing facility to enter a league, then it is pretty obvious that Mr. Goodshow would be the PIA's boss. I tried removing it on both pages, but PAK keeps on reverting it. Can we please discuss this again?! Weedle Mchairybug 16:28, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

You're making an assumption though. Has it ever been stated that Goodshow is the PIA's boss? No, it hasn't. The only confirmed member of the PIA is Nurse Joy, as seen in both Showdown at Dark City and Cerulean Blues. Goodshow is the Pokémon League President, not the Pokémon Inspection Agency President. Now, in all likelihood, the Pokémon League probably does supervise the Pokémon Inspection Agency, but that doesn't make Goodshow the head of the PIA. --PAK Man ^Talk 16:34, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

As he is the Pokémon League President, he is effectively the boss of the Pokémon Inspection Agency, since he runs the Pokémon League, and the PIA's purpose is to either shut down Gyms or make Gyms-in-making Officially Sanctioned by the League. Think of it like the Executive Branch of the Government. The President would not only supervise, but also control the people in the Cabinet as well as those in the various departments, and he listens to their ideas as well. That means that even though The President is not the direct boss of, say, the Department of State [the direct boss would be the Secretary of State], he is still the one who calls the shots towards those groups. Mr. Goodshow is similar in respect. Weedle Mchairybug 16:42, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

But you cannot prove that the League and the PIA are inter-related, and you don't and cannot prove the PIA operates under the same jurisdiction that the League as a whole does; the PIA could be a privately run organization that the League simply trusts the judgments of, like a building inspector or an investigator working under a third party that report back to who hired them. Whoever runs the PIA might be on the same level as Mr. Goodshow and isn't necessarily him to begin with. Luna Tiger * the Arc Toraph 16:53, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

If they truly weren't interrelated, then it as well as Gyms would have been completely separate to the point that they could never work together, having absolutely no similarities whatsoever, to the point that Gyms aren't even part of the Pokemon League in any way shape or form. Weedle Mchairybug 17:18, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

As it stands, nobody in the anime has said they are related. Therefore, you are assuming that they are inter-related. That's speculation, which is not allowed on Bulbapedia. That's why your edits were reverted. --PAK Man ^Talk 18:10, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Even if my statements of their being inter-related are speculation, your claiming that they aren't inter-related or that Goodshow isn't a member is also speculation as well, since we don't know one way or another, therefore that statement about the PIA not having authority still needs to be removed, either way. Weedle Mchairybug 20:17, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Without any canon claim they operate in Sinnoh, YOU cannot say they it is speculation that they don't. It is speculation to assume they do operate in Sinnoh; it is not speculation to assume they do not, as there is no current contrary or evidence to say otherwise. Luna Tiger * the Arc Toraph 20:37, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

The definition of speculation is where you assume that something is or isn't the case without any basis. Saying that it's proven just because it isn't denied is NOT the same thing as basis. It is therefore speculation. Basically, ANYTHING that isn't confirmed or denied officially is considered "speculation." Since it can only be assumed, without ANY REAL basis that they don't work in Sinnoh, it is therefore speculation, hence it needs to be removed.

And for the record, that blurb was not speculation. In fact, it was originally supposed to be in the errors section, but they suggested I place it in Trivia instead. Weedle Mchairybug 20:46, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

And how is part of the storyline an error? It is more trivia-related. And you can't remove it, because removing it means implying that the PIA would have some hand in the Sinnoh region, when canonically, they have not been mentioned to exist in the Sinnoh region. Hence, why the note is necessary to dissuade from any canonical belief that they are involved (because so far, there is nothing to say they are).

Besides, no one of authority agreed to your "deal". Luna Tiger * the Arc Toraph 20:53, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Because it is just a mistake, similar to how Pewter Gym got off scott free in regards to the PIA's test despite failing at least two categories that would have surely shut it down. Unless it is either implied in such a way that most people can agree with or explicitly stated, then neither the PIA having juristiction in Sinnoh nor the PIA not having jurisdiction in Sinnoh should be added in. Keeping it the way I placed it in makes it more in general. How about this then: "Whether this means that Sinnoh is not under jurisdiction of the PIA or it is under jurisdiction of the PIA cannot be determined at this time." right after the part where the "error" is at. That way, it is made ABSOLUTELY clear that we don't have proof one way or another to absolutely determine which case it is, and yet also makes it eligable for being in the Trivia section. Weedle Mchairybug 21:14, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Title

Isn't the Title of the episode actually Arriving in Style! so with a ! as revealed on serebii.net, is it? User:Impoleon xy 17:56, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Error...?

"After Cocoa was shocked that she lost, her crown fell off her head. However, in the next scene, it is still on her head." ...She had plenty of time to place it back on her head, didn't she? Was that really an error? FireMeowth 17:22, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Cleanup

I have cleaned up the synopsis but I need approval from a higher rank to delete the cleanup sign. If anyone could help me with that, thanks. Chrispizza 22:38, 12 July 2011 (UTC)