Talk:Headbutt (move)

The Gen II Headbutt Table

As far I was aware, there were two types of trees: Forest and Mountain. This article fails to make the distinction, and has a number of Pokémon missing from the list, the most notable being Heracross.

To further complicate matters, I possess two conflicting sources of information, and at a guess I'm assuming others do too. The first is an old Prima Game Guide for Pokémon Crystal, and a 'Nintendo Official Magazine' Monster Guide for Gold and Silver.

The Prima Guide listed the Pokemon as such:

Forest Trees

Caterpie, Metapod, Butterfree, Weedle, Kakuna, Beedrill, Ekans, Venonat, Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Noctowl, Ledyba, Spinerak and Pineco.

Available at Routes 26 and 27, 29-32, 35-39, 43, Lake of Rage and Ilex Forest.

Mountain Trees

Spearow, Ekans, Aipom and Heracross.

Available at Routes 33, 42, 44 and Azalea Town.

However, in a section of the NOM Monster Guide it lists Heracross' Mountain Trees and Locations as Routes 29-33 and 42-44.

I'm aware that details published can easily be possibly dubious, but the fact that Heracross is missing from the BP list in the first place, and the BP Pokédex in general is a little indistinct on Headbutting, it may be worth a look in.

So, is there anybody out there who can verify this info? Thanks in Adv. --JaffaJHDA 22:43, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

I just noticed that this article was missing this section. If you must, go ahead and edit it. If you need help with the table, then go to my talk page. ^ht14 00:56, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

After a bit of personal testing, i've found pineco in route 32, casting some doubt on the accuracy of NOM... Unless anyone wishes to dispute the fact this is just playtesting ill test the other doubted routes and edit accordingly... User talk:Parallel

  Ok, just checked routes 32,31,30, 29 and 43, and they're all Forest, making edit now.

In Gen II (silver) Azalea Town has Weedles and Kakunas so it is Forest not Mountain. Also I'm getting a database error whenever I try to edit this page. --Grinnz

Route 29 is a Mountain area, even says so on the Route 29 page. I changed it but messed up the formatting, now I can't fix it because this page is still causing database timeouts. --Grinnz 04:51, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Nevermind, apparently the edit still goes through sometimes but takes several minutes. Anyway I'm going to check other routes in Gen II Silver, maybe there's a difference between gens here. --Grinnz 04:56, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Found (many) Spearows and some Aipom in these places meaning they are Mountain: Route 29, 30, 31, 32, 33

Also found a few Heracross on Route 30. The Spearow concentration here seemed a lot lower, I only found 1 out of the 10 ish battles.

Found Weedles etc in: Azalea Town, Ilex Forest (obviously), Route 35, 36, 37

Route 34 only has one headbutt-able tree and I found nothing there after many tries (like all the trees in Violet City)

Route 46 has no headbutt-able trees.

That's all I'm able to test at the moment, anyone up to check it out in HG/SS? --Grinnz 06:52, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Also I have yet to find an Ekans, Venonat, Hoothoot, Noctowl, or Ledyba (Spinarak would be in Gold) by headbutting forest trees, or Ekans in the mountains; it was said that the guide used for that info was for Crystal, perhaps those are Crystal only? --Grinnz 20:15, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Tested the rest of the Johto locations (still Gen II silver): Forest - Route 38, 39, Lake of Rage Mountain - Route 42, 43, 44 None - Ecruteak City, Mahogany Town, Route 45 Updating the list accordingly --Grinnz 06:01, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

In Pokemon Crystal, I encounter Spearow, Aipom, Heracross and Ekans in Azalea Town (near Kurt's house and elsewhere), which would seem to fit with the mountain category. Is it possible that the trees changed between GS / C ? Could someone confirm this? Betawolf33 07:06, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I'm only finding mountain category Pokémon throughout Azalea Town in Crystal as well.--Gauss (talk) 06:29, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

New Page!

Especially now with HG/SS, I think there should be a separate article for headbutt trees. This page could have a note about the ability to headbutt trees in the associated generations, with a link to that page. What do you guys think? [[Derian]] 16:19, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

What about tutoring!?

The last time I looked, many pages were linked with having Headbutt as a move tutor move in the Generation II remakes. Why does this page not yet have this list? It is a big task, I know, but i do not want to undertake it, or play a part in it, if there is a genuine reason for its absence. Please reply with answers as to whether it needs doing, agreements and/or support in completing this. Thanks, User:Samjohn95

Simply put, we have not yet got around to it. If you have a list by all means upload it. —darklordtrom 07:10, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

Thank you, i will begin work on it as soon as i can. Samjohn95

I can also work on it too since after a small test I can confirm that I should be capable of handing it since I am using the preview button to help with my work. It'll take a while but I'll get it down ASAP. Till then I am keeping my collected details on my Sandbox page.-Tyler53841 02:03, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Despite a few unintended and annoying blunders, my work is complete and I learned from this experience. -Tyler53841 17:51, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

I got halfway through and it appeared! Though I was looking forward to the experience, and my first large-scale edit, I am glad that it is done. Well done. I did do quite well for the Power page... oh well. Congrats! --Samjohn95

Sleep

Can anyone confirm that pokemon who are encountered by headbutting a tree can be asleep in HeartGold/ SoulSilver? I have yet to encounter this. Parallel

First, sign your name. Second, even in GSC, this also occurs depending on the time of day. In the morning, nocturnal Pokémon are asleep, while at night, the diurnal Pokémon are asleep. ^ht14 20:55, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Third, we don't resign our names. As for the question, I misinterpreted it. So... sorry... see if you can find a Hoothoot in the morning via Headbutt. ^ht14 21:30, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Ah, sorry, kinda my first day editing, getting used to some of it. With time set to 5 AM, i couldn't get a Hoot-hoot asleep after aproximatley 10 tries. I also trued Exeggcute, Pineco, Spearow or Heracross during night time and they weren't asleep either. Is it safe to assume they removed the headbutt encounters being asleep? Parallel

Heracross not available in all mountain trees

I have done over 200 battles on routes 33 and routes 42 in pokemon soulsilver and silver, yet have not been able to encounter heracross even once, yet as soon as I start headbutting trees on route 44 I encounter a heracross almost immediately, it seems as though the pokemon encountered cannot simply be divided into mountain/forest trees as the article suggests. Energize 21:13, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

   I've found Heracross in Azalea Town, which is marked as a forest zone. Are we sure the forest/mountain system is still in effect in HeartGold/Soulsilver?  -Hot Dork

Headbutt Trees need attention

I wasn't sure where to bring this up, so I came here. From my observations Headbutt no longer picks Pokémon from two convenient categories. Rather, the available Pokémon seem to be determined on a Route by Route (and at least in the case of Hoenn and Sinnoh Pokémon, tree by tree) basis. I think we'll either need to include which Pokémon are available on each Route's page, or include the Routes on which Pokémon can be found using Headbutt on the respective Pokémon's page. Anyone got any ideas on how we should go about this? --AndyPKMN 16:40, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

An update-- I went through the Pokédex on my HeartGold version. Obviously this won't tell us everything, since we won't know the locations where Ledyba, Ledian, Weedle, Kakuna, and Beedrill live without checking SoulSilver. However, it does tell us about the need for a new system.

Routes 1, 2, and 22, along with Pallet Town and Viridian City, have Hoothoot, Spinarak, Pineco, and Wurmple.

Routes 3 and 4 have Hoothoot, Pineco, and Wurmple.

Routes 5, 6, and 8, along with Cerulean City, have Hoothoot, Pineco, and Combee.

Routes 7, 11, and 16, along with Celadon City and Vermilion City, have Spearow, Heracross, and Combee.

Routes 12, 13, 14, 15, 18, and 21, along with Fuschia City, have Tangela, Hoothoot, Spinarak, and Wurmple.

Route 25 has Hoothoot, Pineco, Slakoth, and Combee.

Routes 26, 27, 29, 36, 37, 39, 30, 31, 34, 35, and 48, along with Ecruteak City, New Bark Town, and the Safari Zone Gate, have Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Spinarak, and Pineco.

Route 28, Mt. Silver, and Mt. Silver Cave have Aipom and Heracross.

Route 32 and Violet City have Exeggcute, Hoothoot, and Pineco.

Routes 33, 42, 44, 45, and 46, along with Azalea Town, have Spearow, Aipom, and Heracross.

Route 38 has Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Spinarak, Pineco, and Burmy.

Route 43 and the Lake of Rage have Venonat, Exeggcute, Hoothoot, and Pineco.

Route 47 has Metapod, Butterfree, Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Spinarak, Pineco, and Heracross.

Pewter City has Hoothoot, Pineco, Heracross, and Starly.

Viridian Forest has Hoothoot, Noctowl, Spinarak, Ariados, Seedot, and Shroomish.

Cherrygrove City has Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Spinarak, Pineco, and Taillow.

Ilex Forest has Caterpie, Metapod, Butterfree, Hoothoot, Noctowl, and Pineco.

National Park has Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Spinarak, Pineco, and Cherubi.

Again, that list does not include SoulSilver-exclusives, but it does show the sheer number of types of Headbutt Trees. I think adding a table to location articles detailing which Pokémon are found in Headbutt Trees would be in order. --AndyPKMN 18:57, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

2¢ says that the Ledyba and Weedle lines merely take the places of the Spinarak and Caterpie lines on the other side of the version-exclusivity. That meaning that where a Spinarak would appear in HeartGold, a Ledyba would appear in SoulSilver; the same goes for a Weedle appearing in SoulSilver where Caterpie does in HeartGold. About the only thing that might be different would be sleep status between the truly version-exclusive lines (Ledyba's a morning Pokémon, while Spinarak's a night Pokémon)...--Shiningpikablu252 03:04, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

On the subject of sleep status... Has anyone actually confirmed that that aspect of Headbutt was carried over into HGSS? From my observations, no Pokémon which formerly could be found asleep in Headbutt Trees (i.e. Spinarak and Hoothoot) can be found that way in HGSS. Of course, I could be wrong about that, because let's face it, I'm certainly not looking for Hoothoot when I use Headbutt. --AndyPKMN 14:45, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

One thing to add is that I want to add is that I usually find Heracross on Route 33, just outside Azalea town and at a semi-common rate. -Tyler53841 15:36, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Deth and I did a little experiment with headbutting trees a few months ago - you just jogged my memory because it was indeed on Route 33, and I too was finding Heracross at a semi-common rate (though Deth, iirc, wasn't finding any Heracross). I can't recall anything else other than that, but I should have the chat log on my computer back home, so I can check later if we had found out anything interesting. 梅子^❀_✿ 15:53, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Good, I hope this can help solve this mystery, and I also recall that I couldn't find Heracross on Route 42 no matter how hard I tried. -Tyler53841 16:11, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Alright, I just checked my brother's SoulSilver version, and the routes that Ledyba, Weedle, etc. appear in trees on ARE the same as the ones Spinarak, Caterpie, etc. appear on in HeartGold.

So where do you think this information should go? It's obviously a little much for this page, so should we add these to the route pages? --AndyPKMN 23:03, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

You left something out, though- there are Natu in Mt. Silver's trees. I've caught one myself. Great list, otherwise.- unsigned comment from Missingno. Master (talk • contribs) 15:15, 10 May 2010 (UTC)

Headbutt occasionally hits Ghost in Emerald??

I've been playing Pokemon Emerald lately, and I noticed something very odd. I have caught a Sableye (two, actually). When in battle with a Linoone on Route 118, I noticed something very odd occur: Normally, Headbutt (a Normal move) shouldn't be able to hit a Sableye, but once during the battle, it did. This has happened to me twice now, and knocked out my Pokémon the second time (possibly the first, I can't remember). Is my copy of the game glitching, or does someone have an explanation for this? SoItBegins 18:45, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Foresight or Scrappy may have been in effect. —darklordtrom 19:49, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Yep-- it was Odor Sleuth. Thanks. SoItBegins 05:14, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

Headbutt Trees STILL need attention

Alright, I can verify that the levels of Pokémon found in Headbutt Trees vary based on the location. Isn't it about time we eliminate the table of which Pokémon are obtainable in Gen. IV, and integrate those Pokémon into the individual Route pages? --Andy^P_K^M_N 17:10, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Apart from being location-exclusive, i think that the trees are very specific as well (i.e. u can headbutt all trees, but pokémon will only be found in certain trees). It definitely is a different system from the forest/mountain one. --> AquaDragon (talk) 10:09, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

I have updated all(hopefully) the gen IV pokemon tables to include a headbutt section. I've also double checked with AndyPKMN's list above with the in-game Pokédex, so most of it should be accurate (except pewter city, it doesn't have Heracross but Wurmple instead). I only left out the levels and rate, putting them to be unknown, because it will definitely require some sampling before a definitive figure can be put in place. I've also sort of deduced the mechanics behind the Headbutt system, but that would need some verification. I've typed it out on the article itself. hope that helps :) --> AquaDragon (talk) 06:47, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Special Trees

In Generation II, the location pages say that certain Pokémon are only found in "special trees." This is referred to nowhere in this article. Which trees are special, and do all locations that have them included on their encounter tables have them? Schreiber 23:55, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

Special trees are the smaller ones all over the Ilex Forest and other various places that when clicked on show it can be headbutted. Those are what the special trees are. :-) Frozen Fennec 00:21, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

No, that's how it works in Generation IV. In Generation II, you can only Headbutt the small ones. So how do we know which ones are special? Schreiber 15:14, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

Deino

It says Deino cannot learn Headbutt in the anime section, however this contradicts part of the page! Chowolun 13:59, 9 April 2012 (UTC) User:Lucario985

Gen IV Pokémon encoutering probability

In the article it says that in Gen IV "if a tree does cause a wild Pokémon to appear, encountering a Pokémon for that tree is 100% even if Repel is being used. Likewise, if no Pokémon appears when a tree is Headbutted, no Pokémon will ever appear for that tree." But I found a tree in SS where I sometimes encounter Pokémon and sometimes I don't. Can someone explain this?Micamike45 (talk) 15:03, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

This is an old post, but based on my playing it seems that a tree will yield a pokemon depending on which Pokemon headbutts the tree. It's probably based on some function of the Headbutting Pokemon's ID number. Tk3141 (talk) 23:44, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Digging up something really old here, but it seems to me the information on the page is still inaccurate. Playing SoulSilver on Route 29 currently and I have a number of trees that yield a Pokemon only on occasion when headbutted several times in a row. Both the Pokemon using the move and the active Pokemon stayed the same and I did not move my character. On average ten Headbutts on a tree yielded eight Pokemon. (Ryonbrink (talk) 13:22, 20 May 2014 (UTC))

Edited to say usually. --Spriteit (talk) 06:41, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Something on Gen II "special trees"

You know, some people do NEVER see Heracross during all their play time. Others do NEVER see a Caterpie or Weedle falling from a tree. By watching videos, reading some forums and playtesting myself, I've came to the conclusion that these "special trees" are different indeed from the normal "mountain" or "forest", and they are also on different locations for everyone. It looks like it depends on something during the game startup (when a New Game is started) or by talking to different NPCs (see Feebas). I have yet to figure out the method, but it seems to be this way, since everybody who has found Heracross has found it in a different tree. Time of the day also seems to affect whether or not Heracross appears, for most people report it appearing only during the night (as for me, I've also seen it during the day). It should also be noted that by Headbutting these trees, the probability of finding wild Pokémon is ~80%, as opposed to a normal tree's ~30%.

On the "mountain or forest" type of trees:

• "Mountain" is only valid for Spearow, Ekans and Aipom.
• "Forest" is only valid for Exeggcute, Hoothoot, Ledyba, Spinarak and Pineco.

Any other Pokémon listed in the "Headbutt tables" seem to belong to the "special tree" category which I explained earlier. A "special tree" may contain some of the "special" Pokémon (like Butterfree), and also "mountain" or "forest" Pokémon (only from one category, never from both). hfc2X 20:30, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Just playtested this theory, 1000 tries per tree for every tree in Azalea town and Ilex forest and seems to be correct although further confirmation may be needed. No heracross at all in Azalea (playing crystal) and several trees in Ilex forest seemed to be "special" fequently dropping butterfree and beedrill (same trees). ThelocknessJohnson 0:45, 21 December 2012

Can confirm this, though not nearly as exhaustively. Was looking for Heracross, spent ~20-30 min per tree in Azalea. Absolutely none until about the 8th one I tried, where I was getting at least 30% Heracross. Incidentally, the Heracross were all awake even though it was night-time and everything else I found was asleep.Gauss (talk) 06:26, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

So, it seems that the categories in which locations are classified also vary between game files. Looks like it's random if a player will get Azalea Town as mountain or forest too. In my Crystal version, it's mountain, but in my brother's Silver, it is forest. Some more research is needed. hfc2X 20:23, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

Common and Rare, or Common or Nothing? (HeartGold/SoulSilver)

Serebii and Bulbapedia state that if a tree does not contain a Pokémon, then that tree will never have Pokémon in it.

However, Psypoke and other sites state that there are "Common" and "Rare" trees, and that Rare trees have a small possibility of containing Pokémon. So what's right? - Colorshade (talk) 19:23, 20 April 2013 (UTC)

Editing issues

I edited the page today and whenever I saved it, it was loading and the page went blank. What is going on? PattyMan 01:47, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Forest and Mountain Pokemon

Excuse me, but I noticed that Heracross, Aipom and Spearow are put in Mountain Pokemon, not in forest Pokemon, while they can be found in Azalea Town, which is listed as "Forest". Can somebody explain me? TheSeviper ♫ハブネーク♫ 11:19, 28 April 2013 (GMT)

Special Trees

Hi there. I was wondering, how do we tell what os a special tree and what isn't in pokemon crystal??RBK (talk) 15:59, 24 November 2013 (UTC)

New info for Pokemon Silver (gen 2)

So i was playing again my Pokemon Silver, and trying to catch a Heracross I started to search those "special trees". Finally I found 1 in Route 30 (see the image for the exactly location of the tree in the map) Also, while on all the other trees the chance of a battle was very low (something like 2-3 battles from 15 headbutt tries), the special tree had a lot more chances to start battles (something like 11-12 battles from 15 headbutt tries) - unsigned comment from .Rawr! (talk • contribs)

Confirming the above post

After many hours of searching for Heracross by headbutting what apparently were not special trees, I tried the tree pictured in the above post, and Heracross appeared after the third try. I cannot confirm all of the factors that are theorized to contribute to the locations of special trees being different for each save file, but I do know that I was finally able to get Heracross after many hours of searching and not once appearance until then. Now, I just need to figure out how to get Mew and Celebi to complete my pokedex... - unsigned comment from Aphilips (talk • contribs)