Talk:Origin Ball

Poké Ball or Key Item

It should probably be decided if we're considering this a Poké Ball or a Key item. It's been flip-flopped a couple of times now. If it's going to be the latter, it should probably be taken off of the Pokéballs template. FenomOO (talk) 11:12, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Can't it be both? It's clearly a type of Poké Ball first and foremost4iamking (talk) 11:15, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

It cannot be both in terms of what page classifications and colors are used. And I would disagree. I see it first and foremost as a key item since it's not personally usable by the player in any way, is only obtainable once, and I'm pretty sure it was held in the key items pocket in the game (though I could be wrong since I already don't remember from my playthrough). FenomOO (talk) 11:23, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

there may only be 1 in the game, but functionally it is a Poké Ball. that's what's important, you can change the colour scheme of the template to match pretty easily. there are other items that at times are considered key items and other times not such as Blue Orb 4iamking (talk) 11:32, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

I mean, to be fair, it doesn't function like anything at all since it's a key item that the player can't do anything with. It is automatically removed from the player's inventory when the related mission is completed after a cutscene. FenomOO (talk) 14:15, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Its removed because its used to catch a pokémon. that's what a poké ball does. 4iamking (talk) 15:32, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Secret Medicine is removed from the player because it's used to heal a Pokémon, and yet it is not a Medicine, but a Key Item. This is the same: while it-universe it's obviously a kind of Poké Ball, mechanic-wise it is not. For the player it's just an important Key Item given and then removed during the story. Kikugi (talk) 15:45, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

mechanic wise, it has all the Qualities a Poké Ball would have, It has a Valid Poké ball Index-ID that's present in the Pokémon's data, it shows up on the Pokémon's summary screen, has a model when thrown in battle and is used to house a Pokémon... that's what Poké balls do and what defines them... Ticks all the boxes to me. As you said its definitely not secret medicine because that doesn't even work on your own Pokémon like medicine would, and is nearly used as an item to block a story progression point. I just feel like if an item clearly fits a certain category, if its a key item or not is secondary... 4iamking (talk) 23:34, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

It is never thrown in battle. The Origin Ball is also just an item to block a story progression point. The only mechanical similarity it shares with other Poké Balls within the game is that it houses a Pokémon (not even of the player's choosing). I feel like if the game puts it as a key item, then it's a key item first and foremost; which is exactly what the game considers it. This is also the first paragraph of text on the Key Item page of the wiki, in which all boxes are checked for the Origin Ball:
"Key Items (Japanese: 大切なもの indispensable items) are special items that players can only obtain once, and either aid the progression of the storyline or allow access to new areas. They rarely have anything to do with the player's Pokémon, and are mostly specific to the different games. The items cannot be bought or sold at Poké Marts, disposed of, or given to Pokémon to hold. Key items cannot be stored in the PC in Pokémon FireRed, LeafGreen, and Emerald. Since Generation II, these items have been given their own classification, and have been stored in a separate pocket in the Bag."
All that said, it does still house a Pokémon for you, and that's it. So I think it makes sense to keep it in the Poké Ball template, but treat its individual page as a key item. I would honestly consider it an event item over a Poké Ball since it mechanically shares more in common with something like the Cherish Ball than a normal Poké Ball. FenomOO (talk) 00:15, 10 February 2022 (UTC)

Either that or the Strange Ball which would probably also need to be a Key item if this is. The way I understand how it works though, is if you hack it into the satchel, you can throw it in battle like any other poké Ball that's the point (the Pokémon obviously wouldn't be legal or anything). Mechanically, LA just treats the Key items bag as a separate partition, and locks items in it but any item in the game can technically be in either bag, just to use any item out in the wild, it gotta be in the Satchel. If you hacked a standard Hisuian Poké Ball into the Key items bag, it would also be unusable. 4iamking (talk) 00:27, 10 February 2022 (UTC)

Is this correct?

"Catches either Origin Forme Palkia (if the player chose to seek materials for the Red Chain with Adaman) or Origin Forme Dialga (if the player chose Irida)" Shouldn't it be the other way around? Palkia with Irida, Adaman with Dialga? - unsigned comment from Demongendered (talk • contribs)

No. You can read the plot summary for Pokémon Legends: Arceus, and see why.--MissDelibirda (talk) 11:48, 31 March 2022 (UTC)

.Oh, nevermind, the summary is wrong.--MissDelibirda (talk) 11:50, 31 March 2022 (UTC)