Talk:Sheer Force (Ability)
Sorry
I was already editing the page to put the link to status ailments when the "do not edit" message was put up. Sorry! --Phantomjunkie 19:01, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
corocoro mistake
The name of this ability should be ちからずく instead of ちからづく. Corocoro keeps printing the wrong name as ちからづく, but every other official source refers to the ability as ちからずく, which could be interesting trivia too :p (Yaminokame 00:49, 5 August 2010 (UTC))
"Invigorate"
Should be "Sheer Strength". →ΑΧΧΟΝΝfire 01:37, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
Ignoring secondary effects?
So I'm a bit confused by what this exactly means... My first impression was that moves like Fire fang which have secondary effects for opponents get a boost, and have the burn chance removed. But then I'm considering a move like Hammer Arm or Superpower. Would those moves also get a power boost and have their NEGATIVE secondary effects removed?
And on the same train of thought would this also affect Flare Blitz's recoil effect? That probably isn't a "secondary effect" (but Flare Blitz's burn effect is) but just want to clarify that, too. Pyitoechito 14:13, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
- Fire fang gets a boost because there is a % chance something happens; in this case burn. Hammer arm and superpower do not have a % chance for an additional effect (it always happens) so they are not affected. Flare blitz might be affected (due to its burn chance) but the recoil would still be there. --Pyritie 15:01, 5 October 2010 (UTC)
Crunch, Steel Wing and similar
What about moves that can reduce the opponent's stats or raise the user's, such as Crunch and Steel Wing? Does anyone know if they're boosted by Brute Force? Mr. Charlie(TalkToMe) 19:32, 27 November 2010 (UTC)
Critical Hit
What bout moves like Slash or Night Slash? Are they boosted as well? --Mr.lol 01:12, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
About move
Should we add list of move which Sheer force is apply? I am one person who dont know what move they wereMeearaimeng 03:34, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
King's Rock
We know that Sheer Force works alongside the Life Orb, but does it work with King's Rock? In theory as King's Rock adds a flinch chance to every move, Sheer Force should give a boost to everything (as well as cutting any negative side-effects along with the flinch effect). DrStubbsberg 21:23, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
- Sheer Force doesn't apply to moves that have been given a flinch chance by King's Rock. Pikiwyn talk 21:30, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
So Sheer Force does not trigger on moves given Flinch by King's Rock. Does this mean the Flinch remains? If so, then wouldn't it be able to boost a move, say Iron Head, and also give it a 10% chance of Flinch, since it didn't originally? Was thinking of running this setup on a Mawile, and was wondering if it was worth it...Crosserenti (talk) 23:48, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
Headbutt?
I finally evolved my Darmanitan and was curious about Sheer Force. I was looking at the list and was wondering if it was complete. It learns Headbutt which has a 30% chance of causing the target to flinch. Should that move be on the list too?--HumDog 06:28, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
Yes, the list is still incomplete. I've added a few more moves, including Headbutt. Magnezone 10:16, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
Color Change
I ran some tests, and it seems that Pokémon with Sheer Force do not trigger Kecleon's Color Change ability (when using a move boosted by Sheer Force). Other on-hit Abilities operate normally. This should probably be added in. - Saethori 10:00, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
If that's true, then feel free to add it, you can add it yourself...Magnezone 12:04, 16 April 2011 (UTC)
Secondary effect that affects self & 100% chance
Flame Charge's effect of raising own Speed never occurs with Sheer Force ability, but I'm wondering whether its power gets boosted or not. It may be a bug/glitch, because as far as we know, moves whose secondary effect affects self are not affected by Sheer Force. Can someone test if moves like Meteor Mash and Steel Wing also never have their effect activated but gets their power boosted? Another odd thing is, Flame Charge's effect chance is 100%, and so far all moves affected by Sheer Force have less than 100% chance to activate their effect....I'll test my Sheer Force Gurdurr to see if it can inflict confusion with DynamicPunch, which has 100% chance to inflict confusion. Magnezone 02:31, 18 April 2011 (UTC)
DynamicPunch confirmed to be affected, so I'll add that in.Magnezone 02:44, 25 April 2011 (UTC)
Also, since Zap Cannon and Inferno are variations of DynamicPunch, that means they should have the same programming for their effect, thus it is very likely that they are boosted by Sheer Force as well, so I added them too.Magnezone 03:04, 25 April 2011 (UTC)
Manga
Black has a Braviary (Nickname: War) that has Sheer Force as abilty. - unsigned comment from Nazirbashir (talk • contribs)
Kingler & Waterfall?
How can Kingler learn Waterfall? And if it can't, why did someone put it here? Krisi 11:56, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
Elemental Fangs
Since Ice Fang, Fire Fang, and Thunder Fang each have two effects that activate after the attack (the flinch and the status condition), does it get the 30% boost for both effects? Or does it negate both and only give a single 30% boost? Diachronos 15:38, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
Only one time since it is only one move. --- Pokémon Questions? -- 14:11, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Probability of effects
When the Pokémon with Sheer Force uses a move that Sheer Force can effect, and the secondary effect of that move only happens sometimes, will Sheer Force only boost power when the secondary effect would have occurred otherwise? For example, if I had a Tauros with Sheer Force use Zen Headbutt, which usually has a 30% chance of making the opponent, will there be a 30% chance of the power being boosted, or will the power be boosted and the flinching be prevented from happening? Mangaman13 (talk) 15:23, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
- Sheer Force always boosts the power; the chance of the added effect occurring is irrelevant. --SnorlaxMonster 15:28, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
Dragon Tail is effected by Sheer Force?
When I played through X and Y I battled against a Druddigon, it used Dragon Tail but I didn't switch out like it was suppose to. Is Dragon Tail actually effected by Sheer Force? If so, we should add it in. Cyan Yoshi (talk) 10:45, 6 September 2014 (UTC) Cyan Yoshi
Life Orb damage calculation
I don't know how the damage calculation for Sheer Force combined with a Life Orb works. They each boost a move by 30% (separately), so would they both take 60% of the move's power at the same time? Or would the Life Orb take 30% of the move with boosted power from Sheer Force? For example, a Sheer Force Feraligatr holding a Life Orb uses Ice Fang. Ice Fang's power is 65, and Sheer Force boosts that to 84.5. Would the Life Orb then take 30% of that? Or would both the Life Orb and Sheer Force take 60% of Ice Fang's power? the great MIKORO (talk to me) 20:12, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
- Sheer Force and Life Orb don't have any special connection regarding damage calculation, so it's calculated like any other combination of damage multipliers, in this case 65 × 1.3 × 1.3 = 109.85 .--電禅Den Zen 20:23, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
- Ok. Thanks Dennou. the great MIKORO (talk to me) 14:01, 1 April 2015 (UTC)
Changes by generation
The list is outdated. I know at least Thrash is now affected by Sheer Force as of gen VI. Maybe the list should be generation-based?MF231 22:07, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
- At this stage we'd just use a suptext template, however I can't find anything that shows Thrash being among the list. PLus it generally doesn't affect negative effects. --Spriteit (talk) 07:44, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
About the items and abilities
When Sheer force negates an item effect (Let's say Life Orb in this case). Does it still boost the move power by an additional 30% ? (It's not specified). Does the same apply to abilities ? (Edit: Nevermind that, I just noticed with a second read it has been discussed before)--Spirekiller (talk) 15:30, 4 April 2017 (UTC)
Core Enforcer and Thousand Arrows
Both do not receive the power boost from Sheer Force. I tested it on Showdown with a Skill Swap Smeargle, a T Arrows/Core Enforcer Zygarde that had received Sheer Force from my Totodile via Smeargle's Skill Swap. Both moves did the same damage to the opposing Hawlucha, Sheer Force or not. (I switched Hawlucha out a few times so the one time effects of Zygarde's moves when used against it, would reset, as I didn't want Sheer Force to ignore them once I'd given Zygarde the ability since the effects won't work a second time.) - unsigned comment from BlazeFire (talk • contribs)
- We usualy cannot be sure of an effect based on Showdown, it should be tested in the actual game. I appreciate your effort in testing it, but I'll put the research template back until we can be sure of the way it works in the games. Also, remember to sign your comments with four tildes (~). Suic (talk) 02:25, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
Mathematical modifier
Bulbapedia's page on the Life Orb includes the fact that Life Orb's modifier to damage is not 1.3 but rather 5324/4096. Is Sheer Force's modifier a clean 1.3 or instead this approximation? Swampboat (talk) 12:13, 12 April 2020 (UTC)
- It is 5325/4096. Fun fact, for /4096 multipliers, the game actually calculates them internally, they aren't specified. For instance, from Gen 5 onward, Gravity's accuracy multiplier is specified as "1.67f," which works out to 6840/4096 (1.67*4096=6840.32, rounds to 6840). Awesomelink234 (talk) 01:05, 5 October 2022 (UTC)
Scale Shot Interactions
When a Sheer Force Pokémon (such as Druddigon) uses Scale Shot, the user's Speed is increased and Defense is decreased. According to the Sheer Force page, this shouldn't happen, "increasing the user's stats [...] are all considered additional effects". I, unfortunately, have no way of checking whether Scale Shot's Power increased. Should the page be edited to address the interaction with this one Move and a research notice be added for testing? Tested this more, Scale Shot with Sheer Force also does not prevent Life Orb or Shell Bell from activating as normal while, as far as I have tested, all other additional effect Moves do. Editing page to include this fact, similar to how it includes information on Fling.
Exempt-Medic (talk) 21:47, 4 October 2022 (UTC)
